Zero Tolerance Policies

Discussion in 'General Education Archives' started by JaimeMarie, Oct 4, 2005.

  1. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Oct 4, 2005

    What do you all think of the zero drug and alcohol polices in high schools?
    Personally I think the policy needs to change. My sister is a senior in high school. She decided (thank goodness) not to go on the senior awareness trip, but doesn't drink..
    One of her friends and three other girls were caught drinking on this trip, there was about 90 kids drinking. One had to be rushed to the hospital to have her stomach pumped. I find it weird that the chaperones didn't see the kids drinking for one. Yes the kids shouldn't have been drinking but now the girls are kicked out of school for 60 schools days. These girls are in all honors or AP classes. They messed up, but I think instead of making them stay home they should put them in in school suspension.
    They all have to go be drugged tested ten days before going back, serve 40 hours community service, and write an essay or something.

    Anyway had to vent. I really don't feel that this is teaching these kids anything, and it could ruin the rest of their lives. And I am positive that most adults drank as teenagers.
     
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  3. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Oct 4, 2005

    "I really don't feel that this is teaching these kids anything, and it could ruin the rest of their lives."

    Consequences related to drinking(alcohol poisoning, drunk driving accidents, drunken ***...etc) can ruin the rest of their lives as well.......
     
  4. Mamacita

    Mamacita Aficionado

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    Like everything else, zero tolerance can be carried to extremes. My son drove some intoxicated friends home from a party one night, and one of them left a can of beer on the floor of his back seat. At school a few days later, the guard saw the can of beer in his car and my son was expelled. The story of what happened made no difference: the policy was zero tolerance and that was that.

    In my old middle school, Chapstick was a drug. So was the wax kids use to keep their braces from cutting their gums. I believe that expelling a student for having those things is absolutely ridiculous.

    In one case, a girl had Midol in her purse and was kicked out for taking one.

    In another case, a special ed student opened a girl's purse, ate a Chapstick and got sick. The girl was expelled for having drugs and giving them to another student. (Personally, I think the kid who violated someone's privacy should have been the one punished, special or not.)

    I read an article about a girl who saved another child's life with her inhaler, and was expelled from school even while the local paper made her a hero.

    As long as administrators are stupid, these stupid decisions will be made.

    Zero tolerance makes a school look tough on paper. In reality, zero tolerance makes a school look stupid.

    If they cracked down on kids who really were abusing drugs, etc, it would be different.
     
  5. JHist

    JHist New Member

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    Oct 4, 2005

    RE: Zero Tolerance Policy

    Well..what are the laws in your state? If it is illegal then it is illegal. Secondly, if it is a school rule it is a school rule. Your child should have been more responsible and taken it out IF he took the rules seriously, which he didn't. You know, it's funny..someone talked about AP students, but it really doesn't matter a rule is a rule. No matter where you go, Drinking will forever be barred from school. If you endorse your child drinking, then that's fine, but, be respectful and observant of the practices of the school and others. If your child is drunk after coming home late from 'school' (really came home late after going to a party or hanging out drinking with firiends.) And they get into a crash, and the story someone gives was that they were coming from school. It can be an ugly mess for the school to some degree.

    THINK about it..
     
  6. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Oct 4, 2005

    True and I believe there should be a consequence. I just don't think 30 missed days of school is the way to go. And one of the girls did get alcohol poisoning. I still want to know where the heck the adults were.
     
  7. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Hi JHist,
    This wasn't my child nor related to me. I do not have children! I don't think they should have been drinking I just don't think the school is handling it properly. I just don't think the schools plan works. I agree with writing an essay and community service. I just don't think they should miss 30 school days. That is 6 weeks of school.
    As for driving: None of them were driving because it was an over night camping trip for seniors (another thing I don't agree with but that is a different topic).
    I found out that two of the girls were expelled for knowing about the alcohol they didn't even drink it. They were expelled for knowing about it and not telling.
     
  8. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Jane I totally agree. I worked at this high school. I reported kids for smoking pot out back. The school didn't do anything. And told the kids that I the one that reported it. It was horrible. I sat in a hallway back then and was harassed.
     
  9. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    Oct 4, 2005

    I agree Jaime, expulsion isn't the answer, at least not for that long. An in school suspension, or if they are expelled, the expectation that they keep up with their classmates somehow. They shouldn't be sitting home doing nothing.......what are they learning from that? I think the punishment should fit the crime, whereas they must meet with families whose lives have been impacted by alcohol.......car accident, AA, etc. That would have much more impact I should think rather then these girls staying out of school.
    And before I forget, I've known NON special ed kids who have eaten chapstick I don't know why they would, but they did)........so it is wasn't done just because that child was spec. ed. And I agree, that was a privacy issue.......but, wanted to clarify that point.
     
  10. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Kinder,
    I think your ideas are wonderful! I think I'm going to write an article for the paper. Can I put some of your ideas in it?
     
  11. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    Of course, good for you for doing that. I bet if you did some research on line about that, you could find some great research to back it up. Please post your article on here when you've finished! I'd love to see it!
     
  12. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I will it might take me a week but I'll post.
     
  13. Upsadaisy

    Upsadaisy Moderator

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    I agree that the 60 day suspension is counter-productive. On the other hand, I was friends with a guy whose 16 year old daughter was killed in a drunk driving accident and the tragedy is just beyond belief. So, the consequences should be extreme.

    What about the adults in charge? Were any held accountable? They should have been, too.
     
  14. JHist

    JHist New Member

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    Re:

    Honestly,

    as we saw prohibition wasn't the answer...but to be real.. I think maybe a req. semester in an alcohol abuse and counseling class would be suitable and they must pass the course with a grade of B or higher. This may hinder on-time graduation, but a decent price to pay for the crime committed..hey it's better than getting kicked out, and they learn something







     
  15. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    That guy is the exact person these girls need to spend their community service time with, or extra time with. They need to have it made real to them so they can see the results of poor choices. They should visit her at the cemetery as well.
     
  16. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I agree with couseling class which they all actually have to take. I just don't agree with missing school.

    Daisy,
    No adults were held accountable!
     
  17. katerina03

    katerina03 Devotee

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    Oct 4, 2005

    JaimeMarie, I agree that the 60 days is counter-productive. I know kids who have committed worse offenses and have been sent to alternative school or juvenile det. and have been back to school in a month or usually sooner.
    The chaperones were obviously neglectful for the girsl to have had time to buy the alcohol and then get consume enough to get poisoned. Were they held accountable at all?
     
  18. JHist

    JHist New Member

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    actually..not miss school..but incorporate that into their schedule..as an elective of sorts..it's one class for the entire semester
     
  19. sdhudgins

    sdhudgins Comrade

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    Oct 4, 2005

    I don't know that 60 days of missed school was the best idea... but...
    if they had been caught outside of a school function, or even worse one of them driven, consequences could have been much much worse.
    I was part of a committee at a school that had about 15 kids removed from the Honor's group BECAUSE of drinking on a school trip.
    Having taken kids on several trips, you can't watch the kids all the time.
    When did they drink? After lights out? Before?
    I know whenI took a group to St. Louis I camped out in the hall of the hotel more than one night, but not all adults are willing to do that.
    The KIDS ultimately are responsible for their actions, not the chaparones
     
  20. AMK

    AMK Aficionado

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    Oct 4, 2005

    Last year my cousin a junior in high school went on a trip with her school to Canada. The night before the trip she had to drop off her luggage to be searched and the luggage stayed at school overnight. I thought that was a good idea only b/c the school is liable if something happened to the kids.

    When I was in high school a few girls got caught drinking on a trip in Europe. They were not expelled or suspended but they had to do so many hours of community service.

    My college was a dry campus. If caught drinking you had to attend AA. If you got written up 3 times for drinking/drugs you were kicked out of the dorms. The college was getting stricter by the time I left.
     
  21. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Actually it was a camping trip and there was suppose to be one chaparone per tent. It was before lights out and some of the teachers saw the kids drinking and told them to go back to their tent.
     
  22. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    That is a agreat idea about leaving bags over night!
     
  23. Lovelabs

    Lovelabs Comrade

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    Oct 5, 2005

    Did the punishment follow the school policy? That's the bottom line. It's black and white. They were doing something they knew they shouldn't do.
    If that is the policy, how can you bend it for some? While I agree the punishment might be a bit excessive, a rule is a a rule. The adults should have been more responsible, but did they tell them to drink? Honestly, we don't want parents making excuses for their children's work not being done or poor behavior in the classroom. Why expect anything else at a school sponsered trip?
     
    Last edited: Oct 5, 2005
  24. Mamacita

    Mamacita Aficionado

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    It is not kids who actually did drink, smoke, etc, being punished that disturbs me. It's kids who are getting the SAME treatment just for having Midol or chapstick or cough drops or inhalers, or for driving kids home so they won't have an accident, or who might have an empty can in their car which is parked in a lot, etc. It's expelling a kid for having a folded pocketknife mixed in with the change in his pocket. It's expelling kids for writing graphically about war, or other situations that involve violence. It's calling kids in to the office to "explain" about their original fiction which involves *** or violence.

    I think some adults in this country have gone insane. I honestly do.
     
  25. Lovelabs

    Lovelabs Comrade

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    I agree with most of that. My response was to the original post. Hope you didn't think I was addressing your comments.
     
  26. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    Jane, you said it perfectly. Political correctness run amuck!
     
  27. Danny'sNanny

    Danny'sNanny Connoisseur

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    A few years ago, when I was in high school, my car broke down on the way to school. I ran back home and got one of my dad's trucks and drove it that day. When I got home that night, we realized that the pistol had been lying in the backseat. If I had been caught, I would have been expelled, zero tolerance for a weapon on campus. I should have looked, but I didn't even think to. No one would have considered that I'm a straight A honors student and it was an accident. I understand the policy, and I know it is black and white, but I am very glad that no one noticed the pistol in the back seat.
     
  28. Lovelabs

    Lovelabs Comrade

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    That would have been terrible. I'm not a big supporter for zero tolerance neccesarily, I 'm just for everyone following the rules. I guess my question is how can we punish one and not another for an offense they both commited?
     
  29. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I totally agree that all punishment should be the same for the same offense. And I do think the girls should be punished. I just feel the policy should be changed. I don't think expelling them for 6 weeks is a good plan. I know one of the girls already two days later has 12 hrs of her 40 hrs of community service done. I think she plans on it being completed by Saturday.
    I just don't think taking their education away is going to help them move into an adult hood as a responsible adult.
    Kids do make mistakes. And they do need to learn from them, but I just don't know what they are learning by sitting home.
     

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