Yelling at students

Discussion in 'Secondary Education' started by Southstream, Apr 27, 2017.

  1. Southstream

    Southstream Guest

    Apr 27, 2017

    My colleague will often yell at his students. His room is next to mine, and we can hear his yelling through the wall. It's not like he raises his voice or speaks firmly; he screams at the top of his lungs. I've never screamed at my students, and I think that's one of the reasons I rarely have problems with them. He refuses, however, to accept my advice that screaming is a terrible option and that his students are just worse than mine. His students walk over him and ignore most of what he says. How can I convince him otherwise (if it's even my place to do so)?
     
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  3. GTB4GT

    GTB4GT Cohort

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    Until he wants advice or decides his way isn't working, you can't.No need to worry about things outside of your own control.
     
  4. rpan

    rpan Cohort

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    I guess it is your place if the screaming is affecting your classroom. But if that's his style, then there's nothing you can do about it.
    Like you, i find that mutual respect goes down so much better than yelling. No one - kid or adult - likes to be screamed at.
    What is the next step after screaming at the top your lungs? There's nothing more you can physically do to intimidate a student into complying.
     
  5. RussianBlueMommy

    RussianBlueMommy Comrade

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    Apr 28, 2017

    I had a teacher in high school that would take the "next step" and start psychologically abusing the students. Shaming them, calling them names openly etc. One time a classmate of mine got an F on a math test, and he pulled him to the front of the class and very loudly said things such as "Take a lesson from so and so, he will be flipping burgers forever. That's if he even knows what a burger is". Things like that. Thankfully, he didn't stay more than a semester...
     
  6. rpan

    rpan Cohort

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    Geez, saying demeaning stuff like that to a kid is straight up bullying and taking advantage of your position of power. Makes me angry that there are people like that in our profession. I had a physics teacher like that in high school as well. He was a bully and used to scream and shout all the time. Heaven help you if you forgot to bring in your homework or he caught you staring into space or if you couldn't answer a question. I dropped his class even though I was pretty decent at physics because I couldn't take the yelling. I was always so on edge and anxious everytime it was time for his lesson. I regret dropping physics but I hate that I was put in a position to have to make that choice.
     
  7. GTB4GT

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    We too have the "angry teacher'" in our building. Sadly, it's apparent to everyone except her that her methods are ineffective. And she seems to derive the least satisfaction from her job. equally as sad is her superiors (admin) complain about the situation BUT DO NOTHING to help her improve.

    But I have come to the conclusion that the teacher most likely to benefit from the collective wisdom of his/her peers are the least likely to be perusing a resource site like this.
     
  8. readingrules12

    readingrules12 Aficionado

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    Apr 30, 2017

    What is your relationship with him? If you two talk a lot, he values you as a teacher, and you have complimented him before, he might listen. For a teacher who is just another colleague to come up and tell him he is yelling, he will probably get very defensive. In time, if he sees you value him as a teacher, he might be open to looking at other options besides yelling. Otherwise, he will probably ignore any advice.
     
  9. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Apr 30, 2017

    In an ideal world you would be able to talk to your administrator about it who would then understand the situation, understand that the teacher could be in a very embarrassing place and subtly connect the teacher with a coach who would help him work through it.

    But it's not an ideal world, and doing that might just make you seem like a snitch, possibly land the teacher in hot water regarding their job, or the admin wouldn't do anything about it. If you think you work in an ideal school however, I would bring it up with admin, maybe not even naming names, just saying that you think a teacher in your hall could use some strategies and coaching to deal with classroom frustrations in a more constructive way.
     
  10. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    It's not your job to convince him about classroom mgt.
     
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  11. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Just curious, to anyone in general, not just you czacza, what would you do if there were another teacher in your department who you knew was being ineffective, and possibly harmful to students? Would you address the teacher? Talk to the admin? Or just ignore it? (and what if it causes issues for you personally, as in the case of the OP having to deal with noise issues)

    I get not wanting to butt into others business, and am generally all for that, but I'm just wondering where the line is drawn.
     
  12. AmyMyNamey

    AmyMyNamey Comrade

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    I've known a great many inner city youth who will not respond to anything less. You can ask them if they are making a good choice or a bad choice, and they'll tell you to get the f*** out of their face.

    I don't think Mr. Rogers works on every kid.
     
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  13. jteach89

    jteach89 Companion

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    Is the teacher new? Has he always yelled/screamed like this? I had a sub in the best way possible tell me to "quiet down". It was a monday, and I was so annoyed with my kids. I wasnt screaming but really yelling, ALOT. I typically don't yell but I was going through some things. Anyway, she pulled me aside and said you need to look within, and worry about "your self first" It guess it was a nice way to approach I guess it but I was still offended. I went home and cried about it. I was also resentful because all she does is sit on her rhaz all day and I bets shes making top of the crop lol. but thats besides the point. idk I was offended by her comment it really hurt because I really felt alone and battling a lot of issues at the time so I did take her comment to heart.

    But maybe you can approach the teacher in a "nicer" way maybe something like, I heard you yelling today is everything alright? Maybe offer advice if he's willing to listen. Or go in the class and say admins are around or something. (IDK) Try not to impose i guess. Over time maybe he will get it...
     
  14. AmyMyNamey

    AmyMyNamey Comrade

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    So it's official: We are not allowed to raise our voices to misbehaving students?

    Come on down to Indianapolis and show us how to do that!
     
  15. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Raising your voice once in a while is different than angrily yelling at students.

    Personally, unless the teacher is bullying the student, I don't really care. I just thinking yelling angrily at students is a waste of energy, and really just shows the students that the teacher is easily manipulated emotionally. I would care if it disrupted my classes next door though.

    And if I were that teacher and was emotionally and physically exhausting myself everyday, I would very much appreciate it if someone showed me a better way to manage my classroom if it were done tactfully.
     
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  16. jteach89

    jteach89 Companion

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    Well technically, at least here in NY we are not supposed to do anything that is is reflective of corporal punishment. I would imagine yelling, isolating/staring at the wall (putting a kid on time out) , threatening the students (im gonna call your mom etc),

    And yet students can curse at you, hit you, throw chairs, stab you with items and yet we are not supposed to anything. We are supposed to be "proactive" instead of reactive. Which I do get but we are human.

    I do get that yelling often or to much isnt as effective over time. There is a teacher in my building, shes a great teacher I've never heard her really yell. She may raise her voice and make a stern face but I've never heard her voice from across the hall. I always tell myself, I want to be that teacher when I grow up lol
     
  17. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Define harmful. I'm in a union. And as tough as that is sometimes in such situations. It's not my job to report yelling or ineffective teachng to admin.
     
  18. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Would you report if you heard the teacher berating students? (i.e. "You're so stupid", etc.)

    I hope it's clear I'm not trying to argue btw. I'm just curious what people would do in different situations.
     
  19. CherryOak

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    You could try - if allowed- to convince him to videotape some of his classes so that he can closely observe the students' behavior/triggers/patterns. Maybe he would accidentally be surprised by how his tantrums look. ?

    I've often wondered where I drew the line, too, Peregrin. I haven't figured it out yet.
     
  20. RussianBlueMommy

    RussianBlueMommy Comrade

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    You know, this is an interesting thread. I don't think there is a teacher in existence that has never had their patience tried and lost patience with a student or students. When the class is completely chaotic and psychotic, it's all you can do to keep composure sometimes. That being said,

    Is he actually yelling/belittling etc or does he just talk loud? I know some very sweet and loving teachers that just have a loud voice.
     
  21. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    I'm.hoping those kids tell their parents what is said in the classroom.
    As a colleague, you could stop by that teacher's room during a free period and share what you heard as well as your concern for your colleague's frustration and possible repercussions if admin found out if kids do go home and share what going on.
     
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  22. AmyMyNamey

    AmyMyNamey Comrade

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    What I'm seeing is a whole lot of people quick to judge and quicker to report something that might make them uncomfortable, rather than step into a leadership role and offer support and guidance.

    Perhaps making a situation worse instead of better makes some people feel they are saving the children and being a hero. I have colleagues at work who do the same.

    Too many are hypocrites who will scream at kids until they are red in the face, but criticize someone they don't like for raising her voice. We are often automatically forgiving or understanding where friends are concerned, but doubly critical of someone who rubs us the wrong way. And a great many teachers get upset when a man raises his voice, but not bat an eye when a woman does the same. My husband says that "screeching and nagging" is bothersome, so I understand much of this is simply a matter of perspective.

    I've never seen Mr. Rogers filmed in the 'hood, but I'd like to see that played out.
     
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  23. Leaborb192

    Leaborb192 Enthusiast

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    ,
     
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  24. Leaborb192

    Leaborb192 Enthusiast

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    ,
     
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