Writing names on ths board

Discussion in 'Debate & Marathon Threads Archive' started by otterpop, Jul 20, 2014.

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  1. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Jul 20, 2014

    I agree completely! And it's not just teachers that have these differences of opinions and think they're completely right. It's in all of the classroom management literature as well. Which made it much harder today to try to buy a CM book I haven't read yet at B&N, because I realized of the books I did read there was just so much varied advice.

    There's no one single answer to classroom management.

    I've since figured out that you do what works for you. Every teacher has a different situation and different kids and haven't experienced enough other types of classrooms to be able to say definitively that what someone else does in their classroom is wrong.

    That's not to say that we shouldn't share what works for us in our classrooms, because we can share good ideas and things others might want to try, but we should probably stop being judgmental.

    Lol! I won't go so far as to say they don't exist, but I will say that a lot of teachers who say they have such a classroom are lying through their teeth.
     
  2. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    That's why my motivation against using public consequences isn't to save the child from humiliation. Everyone knows exactly what happens, and in many cases that's a good thing because kids know your consequences are being applied in your cm system.

    However keeping it private:

    1. Makes it LOOK like you're trying to save the child face, which is good for building a relationship with them in the future.
    2. Makes it a little less clear about what you're doing, so students can't call you out specifically on any changes you made from your CM plan so you can tailor consequences a bit more to the student at hand.
    3. It teaches other kids to just mind their own business. They need to learn that not everything that happens in the class is something they need to know.
    4. You don't have 23 names written up on the board so your Principal doesn't think you can't manage your classroom when she walks in.

    There are probably a few other benefits I'm missing but you get the idea.
     
  3. agdamity

    agdamity Fanatic

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    One tip that I learned years ago was to stop at each child's desk, get on their level, and whisper something positive to them. By ensuring that you do this with every child, and by starting with a positive, you can then do the same technique with negative behavior, but it's not so obvious. For all a student on the other side of the room knows, you are not handing out consequences.

    If you are stopping to write names on the board, can't you just as easily write it down on a post-it?
     
  4. TnKinder

    TnKinder Companion

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    Jul 20, 2014

    I have written names on th boared. It's usually when something big is coming up like a sock hop. I don't see a problem with it, but I also don't have a problem with children feeling bad about their behavior. I think at some point children have to be made aware that actions have real consequences. If you don't like seeing your name on the board, stop the behavior. And I know that some students, like those with ADD/ADHD, are somtimes unable to control behaviors. In those cases I follow the behavior plan.
     
  5. pwhatley

    pwhatley Maven

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    Jul 20, 2014

    I am the "mean" teacher at my school. That being said, my kids and I love each other, and they know that I will do all I can to protect and to foster their ability and opportunity to learn.

    For several years, I used a clip chart. It worked fine most of the time. Last year, however, I had an unmedicated bipolar child in my class (I've known her for a long time, and we actually have a great relationship), and if her clip was moved down AT ALL, it would ruin her day... even if it was 8:10! I gave multiple opportunities to "clip up," but she just couldn't handle it. It also didn't work well with a couple of "transfer" kids (moved to our school for behavior), so I ended up taking it down. I got it made at VistaPrint on vinyl, so I still have it, should I ever want it again. I've never had anyone take issue with it for privacy reasons though... though to think of it, the clothespins had the students' numbers on them instead of names.

    Now I use sticky notes and a clip board. I agree that "pretending" to write things down really helps! I also use a LOT of proximity! I am physically unable to kneel down at their eye level, so I will often roll my chair over next to theirs. I do this often, when reading, when guiding practice, whatever, especially if my back is giving me problems, so it's not such a "public" display. There are some, however, at least in my population, who do not hear a gentle "Bobby, let's settle down now," or "Mary, it's time to put the scissors up." I have a strong voice, from years of vocal training (music major) and being a drum major (I can project), so it's not unusual for me to have to call someone's name loudly, just to get their attention. My kids know that when I get quiet, something is REALLY wrong! LOL!
     
  6. Go Blue!

    Go Blue! Connoisseur

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    Jul 20, 2014

    I will agree with you on this as another main reason why I don't write names on the board. My Admin suggests that this can be a good behavior management tool, but then they punish people when they show that they are having problems managing behaviors.
     
  7. TnKinder

    TnKinder Companion

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    If a teacher has 23 names on a board, they have poor classroom management. Once a name is written as a warning and the behavior continues, the consequence has to be issued. Then the whole class knows that there is follow through. It doesn't end with the name going on the board.
     
  8. swansong1

    swansong1 Virtuoso

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    Public discipline that I don't use is posting names on the board, using a clip chart, making a bulletin board to track behavior. All of those systems make the discipline public to anyone, other than students and teacher, walking in the room.

    Of course teachers will use verbal discipline when it is needed, or whisper in an ear now and then.
     
  9. Loomistrout

    Loomistrout Devotee

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    Reality says every teacher goes public to some degree. The difference is for many it's rare while for others it's an everyday, every period event.

    At his training seminar Fred Jones demonstrates "working the crowd" or using proximity to curb problems. Five teachers role-play students working at their desks as Fred moves among them, stopping and bending over to offer help - what a typical teacher might do during guided practice. After about two minutes of this Fred stops and asks the rest of the teachers, "Raise your hand if you can tell me who is in trouble?" No hands. Then he asks the role players, "Raise your hand if you are in trouble." One of the role-players raises hand. "Why couldn't any of you (teachers) tell who was in trouble?" Fred inquires of the group. Most responses are similar, "Because it looked like you were just helping each student." Fred, "Exactly! I don't want you to know."

    If a teacher can get the student back to work with a private word it becomes one of the simplest and least risky of interventions. Doubtful any student is going to stand up and shout, "Hey Teach! Thanks for not embarrassing me in front of my buddies. I really appreciate it!" The student is well aware you protected him/her unlike what they are used to.

    Discipline management is all about making decisions. Most small problems escalate into large not because of the student. Often they get larger because of the teacher's decisions. The more frequently one crosses the line into public discipline the greater the risk for revenge, defiance, giving up and playing to the crowd on the part of the student. This is not to say one should never use public discipline - some acts demand it - rather a vote to use the smallest amount of discipline to get the job done.
     
  10. Peregrin5

    Peregrin5 Maven

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    Jul 21, 2014

    23 was an exaggerated made up number to make a point, but sure.
     
  11. MrsC

    MrsC Multitudinous

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    Jul 21, 2014

    Love this!
     
  12. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Jul 21, 2014

    Proximity

    Walk by and put hand on back for a moment

    Do a turn and talk and the go listen in on the conversation, give positive comments such as 'you have so many good ideas, can you share this with the group when we rejoin so not just your partner hears what you have to say?'


    :love::thumb:
     
  13. allaragallagher

    allaragallagher Comrade

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    Jul 21, 2014

    No, I don't plan on writing names on the board. My mentor teacher did. She would write detention or incomplete on the board and then list the names of the students underneath. One student complained to his mother that it made him feel stupid and she was told she was no longer allowed. The next year? She went back to listing names on the board, but she just retired so...
     
  14. HistoryVA

    HistoryVA Devotee

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    I don't use it. Students who borrow pencils write their names up to remind themselves to return it, but that's it. I've always disliked names on the board. Yes, calling a student out is public (although can be minimized), but if it happens, even if the name is said, it's dealt with and you move on. When the kid's name is starting him in the face for the rest of class, I think it's embarrassing and creates more of a "well, fine, you already think I'm bad, so screw it, I'm gonna be bad" situation.

    I use proximity, I use general statements and I use "fake outs" a lot. I keep a rolodex of student contact info on my desk. If I have students who are getting irksome, but not truly call out level, I'll just flip through the cards, pull one out and set it to the side. It's usually random, but because I have called home with that same method, it works as a wake up call and the kids usually straighten up.

    I do call students by name if it reaches the point that we need to discuss the issue in private, but if it reaches that point, the student has outed themselves already with blatant disrespect/insubordination, etc.
     
  15. iteachbx

    iteachbx Enthusiast

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    Sometimes I can't give the point right away and also because students can't see the points. Students can get a certain number of negative points in one day with no consequence. (I think it was 3 this year but I didn't have anyone get anywhere near 3 the last half of the school year.) I did it this way for two years, except students really never knew how many negative points (or resets as we called them) they had. I wanted them to be able to check in on themselves. This prevented me from having to do the "you know you have one more chance" or "if I have to speak to you one more time" I simply gave our the reset and they saw for themselves when they had reached a consequence.
     
  16. brigidy

    brigidy Comrade

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    Jul 22, 2014

    After reading this, I have decided that I may change how I incorporate my management strategy this year. I have used a clipchart that goes up and down, if the student makes it to the top they get a sticker at the end of the day. It is large and uses clothespins. However, I may use a similiar method with a clipboard where it will be private, yet I will still have the information I need. Thanks for giving me something to think about.
     
  17. live

    live Companion

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    Jul 22, 2014

    I write kids' names on the board often, but not for poor behavior. I write birthday messages, congratulatory messages, lists of who is coming in for extra help, who needs a copy of something, names of kids who borrowed something, groups, and so on. Often kids ask if we can add certain reminders on the board. If I was to write SEE ME AFTER LUNCH and a name or 2, I don't think the kids would think twice or feel publically shamed. It could be for anything.
     
  18. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

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    I wonder how this would work if the administrator did this for teachers? Have a big white board in the office and have teacher's names on it. Knowing that sometimes it means that a teacher is in trouble and sometimes it does not, I wonder what the gossip mill would be like within the school and among the parents who would quickly know what the board was for. So, is Ms. Smith in trouble? Wonder what she did? Remember last year when...
     
  19. 2ndTimeAround

    2ndTimeAround Phenom

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    a2z, your analogy is falling flat. The day that students have the same responsibilities as me and I have the same luxuries as them, is the day that I'll seriously consider your question.
     
  20. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

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    That's right, because children aren't adults and don't have the same responsibilities, we don't have to consider how our actions impact their feelings and how things we would never want done to us is completely acceptable to do with them. It's ok if our method starts the rumor mill by students, parents, or teachers because they see the name on the board because they are kids.
     
  21. 2ndTimeAround

    2ndTimeAround Phenom

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    Again, you're reaching.
     
  22. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

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    We'll disagree then. I don't feel it is acceptable to do something to a student if it isn't something we would accept being done to us as people (adult or not). Power difference is the same teacher/student vs admin/teacher. The only difference is age which in my opinion has no bearing on certain actions.
     
  23. readingrules12

    readingrules12 Aficionado

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    Actually, this happened to us many years ago. There was a P who would write on the lounge's white board the teachers who didn't hand in their lesson plans on time. It never happened to me, but I and many teachers thought it was awful. The P won no points with teachers on that.
     
  24. Loomistrout

    Loomistrout Devotee

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    Exactly. There are some adults who should lose their recess. Seriously, a classroom rule I see posted often: Respect the rights and dignity of others. I have yet to come across a posting which states Respect the rights and dignity of others (teacher has option to ignore this rule) It is interesting some teachers will jump all over a kid for belittling, embarrassing and/or making fun of a another student. Several minutes later and in an "adrenalin moment" some of the same teachers will announce loudly, "Name! This is the third time I've had to stop due to your talking! How many times are you going to interrupt me? I'm writing your name on the board! Any more of this and you will get a check, and you know what that means! Do you understand?!!"
     
  25. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

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    Jul 23, 2014

    I believe for many it is because although they know there are other techniques that can be used, they don't know how to use them appropriately. So, if they tried it before it didn't work or it felt so unnatural because they weren't practiced at using the techniques. Normal behavior is to fall back to what is easiest and most comfortable for both children and adults.

    I believe there are only a very small subset that humiliates on purpose.
     
  26. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Jul 23, 2014

    Great post!

    There are certainly more meaningful and positive ways to manage behavior than writing names on boards and other public proclamations of who's in trouble. The goal of behavior management should be self management, self discipline. :thumb:
     
  27. Loomistrout

    Loomistrout Devotee

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    Agree. I don't think teachers enter the profession with a mind set of "Who can I make life miserable for today?" Lacking a sophisticated, on-going discipline training program many teachers rely on what they remember from their own upbringing, borrow from colleagues or, as my college supervisor told us scholarly, "You won't have to worry about discipline if you teach your lesson well enough. In any event, you will pick it up as you go along."
     
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