What Things Do You Tolerate in a Relationship?

Discussion in 'Teacher Time Out' started by Ms. I, Oct 17, 2009.

  1. bonneb

    bonneb Fanatic

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    Thank you for asking. Porn is more insidious than a physical relationship. I despise the porn industry. I despise that it is served up on a silver platter in the privacy of your own home and in EVERY hotel room in our country.

    It is insidious because it is like a growing monster. At first, a little is enough for a thrill. Then one needs more and more stimulation for the same thrill - kinda like alcohol. It is a downward spiral that keeps demanding more stimulation for a thrill.

    In my opinion, from the studies I have done, it leads to more and more degradation of the person involved. The studies I have consulted show a direct link between "normal" porn and child porn, and I think we are all in agreement here about child porn. I am not talking off the top of my head - I've studied the porn industry, child abuse, and the link between the two for many year. I have counseled many women who have been abused with a direct connection to porn. People I love dearly have become "hooked" on porn and it has destroyed their families and their lives.

    It is sleazy and there is not one good thing about porn.

    A physical affair is more forthright - you can trace the cause, find answers to overcome. I can seee why my statements might have sounded conflicting. I just hate the porn industry with every ounce of my being. And just for the record, I have never been into porn, but I was harmed by porn. My DH has never been into porn, it has never come up on our computer, and he guards against it through an internet system where you choose a couple of friends who are notified if you go to a porn site - keeps everyone accountable to each other.
     
  2. bonneb

    bonneb Fanatic

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    Also TeacherShelley -

    The internet porn would be more intolerable to me because it was coming into MY house. I feel I have a right to say what does and does not go on in my house, so if I found it I would terminate the life of the porn instantly!! This is a big part of the issue. Like if a spouse brought a woman home to your own bed - eewww . . . I would have to set the bed on fire.
     
  3. JustMe

    JustMe Virtuoso

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    I also think pornography is far beyond simply disgusting. It pushes a button deep inside me and I can't necessarily explain my hatred for it. And I don't care for a moment if every person walking this earth thinks I'm being irrational. I know many people who not only feel it is acceptable, but healthy. I am not one of those people. My husband knows that I consider him viewing pornographic materials as being unfaithful and as such I would not stay with him if took part in it. It's also never been an issue, but I also made that very clear when we first got together. I laid out a few expectations immediately into our relationship--so soon than most people would have ran the other way--because I wasn't wasting a moment of my time on a person who might have taken issue with any of my non-negotiables.
     
  4. blessedhands

    blessedhands Comrade

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    No drinking or smoking, cheating, no form of disrespect which includes using profanity directed towards me. No physical, verbal, or mental abuse. No outside children.
     
  5. Canadian Gal

    Canadian Gal Habitué

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    No outside children? What does that mean? Is that a polite way of saying no "illegitimate" children?
     
  6. bonneb

    bonneb Fanatic

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    I thought it meant no children from another relationship, which is actually very important to consider for the long term.
     
  7. Ms. I

    Ms. I Maven

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    bonneb, that's what I was thinking too. No other kids w/ another woman while dating her.
     
  8. blindteacher

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    Lots of times abuse is on both people in the relationship. It's easy to say the person did the hitting is the victimizer and the person who got hit is the victim. But lots of times the "victim" provokes the "victimizer" by hitting him or her emotionally. Lots of times the "victim" manipulates the "victimizer" which leads to the "victimizer" getting physical. Physical hitting isn't the only type of hitting there is but it's often the only type of hitting that is acknowledged in an abusive relationship. More often than not, both members are fully involved in the abusive nature of the relationship.

    I say this having been in many abusive relationships myself. (Perhaps not spousal but relationships nevertheless.)

    I also say "him or her" because too often we equate the victimizer with "male" and the victim with "female," and while it's true that is the most common occurrence, it's unfair to completely overlook situations where the sexes are flipped or where both members are of the same sex.
     
  9. blindteacher

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    On the topic of cheating, cheating is difficult. Lots of times the cheater really falls for another person. It's hard to reconcile those feelings with the ones of still being in a marriage or a committed relationship.

    I don't think people are, in Ms. I's words, bastards for falling for another person. But rather for the way they deal with it. My wife and I feel very lucky that we have dodged the cheating issue because if ever one of us develops feelings for another person, the other one of us will be the first to know. She has had a bit of a crush on another person before. I don't really mind so long as she keeps it open and honest. For me it's not the falling in love part of cheating that bothers me but rather the dishonesty, so as long as we keep it honest, I'm fine with her having a wandering eye.
     
  10. Ms. I

    Ms. I Maven

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    blindteacher, I agree w/ you. Above is the portion of what I specifically said when I said the cheater is a bastard. At the time, I didn't specifically detail out IN WHAT WAYS he's a bastard because my reply to the other poster wasn't getting into those specifics back then.

    I know people say all the time that people can't help who they fall in love w/, BUT as we all know, there's a right way & a wrong way to go about it when one is already attached to someone & falling for someone else. Yes, they're a bastard if they cheat. The RIGHT way is for the person to break it off w/ their partner when they find themselves falling for someone else & they know they want to go to another level w/ this new person.

    I've always told my BFs that if they're unhappy in our relationship for any reason, don't cheat on me, break it off first at least.
     
  11. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    Whoa, whoa, whoa.

    I disagree. Strongly.
     
  12. CanukTeacher

    CanukTeacher Comrade

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    "Lots of times abuse is on both people in the relationship. It's easy to say the person did the hitting is the victimizer and the person who got hit is the victim."

    I'm sorry but that is a slippery slope I don't agree with. That type of argument is what leads people to blame women for being attacked by strangers - she was "asking" to be raped because of how she was dressed. I'm not saying that anyone was making this argument but if someone is beating someone else up the person being beat up is a victim and it isn't likely that they instigated the abuse.
     
  13. bonneb

    bonneb Fanatic

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    I don't really think we can generalize about abuse - every case is different.

    I will say that it is absolutely true that if a person has been abused, they often do not have the ability to leave - their minds have been twisted the wrong way and they are not able to think straight. That is why they need support from others who can see clearly what is happening.
     
  14. blessedhands

    blessedhands Comrade

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    :thumb:Exactly. I do not think I can handle that.
     
  15. Canadian Gal

    Canadian Gal Habitué

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    Why not? Children are a blessing, no matter how they come into our lives.
     
  16. blindteacher

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    Uh oh, I may have been seriously misunderstood. I'm not talking about "wearing the wrong clothing" and therefore "asking to be raped." I'm not talking about the victim "deserving" the abuse. I should also mention I am talking mainly between two adults and two people with the same level of power (which is the main situation being discussed in this thread since we're focusing on spousal abuse.) I'm saying that usually the abuse is a two-way street and both participants abuse each other, but that one may get recognized and not the other.

    I am not saying it's okay to hit someone or abuse someone or giving an excuse to abuse/hit someone. That's never okay. Rather, I'm saying that domestic abuse is usually a result of an escalation with active participation from both parties. It may only become visible once one party resorts to physical abuse, but usually there are a series of signs leading up to the abuse that both parties have ignored. And since both parties have missed the numerous red flags, often the situation comes to a point where the relationship has become abusive, something both parties could have avoided had they noticed the red flags earlier on. That's what I mean when I say more often than not, it's the responsibility of both parties.

    I hope I was able to make more clear what I'm saying.
     
  17. blindteacher

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    I agree that every case is different, but there are common threads that characterize most abusive relationships.
     
  18. CanukTeacher

    CanukTeacher Comrade

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    BT,

    I do understand that you were talking about spousal abuse but I do still think that it is still a slippery slope. I'm not at all implying that you were supporting the "its okay" argument but that your statement is one that can lead to others.

    And I do understand what you are saying but my point is simply that if you hit someone you are responsible. If your partner did something to provoke you, you have a choice - like you can walk away rather than try to strangle them.
     
  19. TeacherShelly

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    I'm not sure, but I think the "outside children" referred to kids from prior relationships? Having been a stepchild, I can say I am beyond happy NOT to be a stepmother. That has to be one of the toughest most thankless jobs out there. I'm also really happy that my daughters don't have a stepmother. If I die young and they get one, may she be a saint and love them like her own, but be satisfied with never stacking up.
     
  20. Ms. I

    Ms. I Maven

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    TeacherShelly, I agree. I wouldn't want to date a guy who already has kids. The only exception is maybe, maybe if the child is only so many months old & the wife passed away...& the guy is worth it. Oherwise, it's trouble, trouble, trouble. I don't want any other woman always in the picture my entire life! Heck no!
     
  21. Canadian Gal

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    Wow. That was just mean.

    No, I'm not joking. If he had a previous relationship and had a child, what's the problem with that? Why can't his child from another relationship be a blessing? I love kids, plain and simple, regardless of where they came from.

    No one ever said anything about a guy cheating and getting someone pregnant on the side... that goes with cheating, and while I think that cheating is because of a broken relationship, and impregnating someone else might irreparably damage the relationship. Cheating itself my irreparably damage a relationship. However, if it didn't destroy my relationship, I may well accept the child as a blessing.

    As for the comment that I am "used to" being cheated on, no. No woman is ever USED to finding naked pictures of other girls on their SO's phone. Or answering his phone and it being a girl who demands to know who you are. No girls are ever used to flying in early to surprise their SO and finding another girl in his bed. No girl is ever USED to any of that stuff. There was no need to be cruel, which that comment is.

    I know my relationship was broken. The break was both of our faults. How he dealt with it to put it bluntly sucked, but I made an immature choice as well, to take advantage of the generosity that he inevitably showed after I caught him. We were young and selfish and we hurt each other. That's what time and distance has taught us, and that's how it has kept us friends. It doesn't mean cheating is not a big deal. I just see it for more than just the act of cheating.
     
  22. Canadian Gal

    Canadian Gal Habitué

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    I've had 3 step-dads (through marriage) and 2 (through common law relationships) as well as 3 step-mothers. I agree the job is thankless. I am still really close to two of my step-dads... I call one of my younger brother's Dad's Dad as well, and one of my step-moms, and I will remain forever grateful that they were willing to overlook the fact that my parents had kids and love us for who we are.
     
  23. Ms. I

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    You're misundertsanding CG. Blessedhands already confirmed that she meant her guy having kids by another woman WHILE SHE'S DATING HIM...NOT a man who already had kids when she started dating him.

    That's why what you first said seemd so callous & cold. OK, let's wipe the slate clean now...no hard feelings. :)
     
  24. TeacherShelly

    TeacherShelly Aficionado

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    My stepdad used to say he had to be twice the man my dad was to get half the credit. He is/was a good stepdad but I missed my own father and my mom MADE me call my stepdad "Dad" which felt very disloyal and I hated that.
     
  25. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    I am confused. I thought that what blessedhands meant was that she didn't want the guy to have children from a previous relationship. I didn't get the impression that her statement was about cheating getting the 'mistress' pregnant.
     
  26. TeacherShelly

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    Yes, blessed hands meant not having kids from past relationships. I think Ms.I owes CG an apology. :sorry:
     
  27. Canadian Gal

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    See and that's more of a Mom problem. My Mom never made me call any of my step-dads anything (well apart from the words I wasn't allowed to call two of them!). My bio-Dad (who I also call Dad when I talk to him, but I call him by his name the rest of the time) encourages me to call his current wife Mom, which will never happen.
     
  28. Ms. I

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    Oh no, that's too bad. No one should ever make someone call someone something they're not. Just like I can't stand the families who have really, really close friends & the kids call the adult friends uncle (so & so) and aunt (so & so). They're still not family, so why call them that! :mad::confused:
     
  29. Ms. I

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    OMG, can eveyone please look at post #134 on page 14, so you can see what blessedhands really meant! :D
     
  30. TeacherShelly

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    I also want to clarify, so I don't owe anyone an apology...

    While I am thankful that I'm not a stepparent, I do believe there are wonderful, worthy people in the dating pool who have children from previous relationships! I would not rule out anyone for having kids (heck, my dad was saddled as a single parent with me when he was 22!). And I hope I was a gift to my stepparents, not just a booby-prize for marrying my mother or father.

    That doesn't change the fact that my simple family with a mom, dad, two kids and a cat makes me extremely happy.
     
  31. Ms. I

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    Yes, that's good that your mom didn't make you. :)
     
  32. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    For some families, the terms 'aunt' and 'uncle' are as much about endearment as genetic relationship.

    I have dozens of 'real' aunts and uncles, my parents' siblings and their spouses. I also remember having a handful of grown-ups around who weren't technically family but might as well have been. These people would come to family events, holidays, etc. They were always around. They cared about our family just like they were a part of it. I called some of them 'Auntie Soandso' or 'Uncle Whosiwhats'. I don't feel bad about that. In fact, it makes me happy to know that my cousins and I were special enough that these folks wanted to be part of our family even though they didn't have to be.

    If you don't like the practice, don't do it.
     
  33. TeacherShelly

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    My mother was in denial. She wished she'd only married the one guy (her first and fifth marriage was to the same man, my step-dad!) and had all the kids with him. But no, she had one with him, two with two others, and he had two with his second wife (she's his first and third wife). I think she was drinking too much, too.

    I think that whole Uncle/Auntie ritual is common with Asian families? I don't like it either, but I do understand it, I think.
     
  34. JustMe

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    I was confused too. I thought to myself, who would even put that on a list of relationship dealbreakers? You can't impregnate another woman while with me. That seems pretty...basic. But when Ms. I said Blessedhands confirmed it, I looked back to see for myself.

    Bonneb explained: "No other kids w/ another woman while dating her." Then Blessedhands said: "Exactly. I do not think I can handle that."

    I have to admit, I totally see how Ms. I misunderstood, as silly as it sounds. It does read as though Blessedhands doesn't want her special someone creating children with other women while she's dating him. :)
     
  35. TeacherShelly

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    I think there are some (Asian cultures, esp) who use Auntie and Uncle almost like titles. Kind of like in the South they say, Miss Michelle instead of Michelle. I have many friends who instruct their kids to call me Auntie Michelle. I don't have my daughters do that, though, because it isn't my tradition.
     
  36. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    The posts by Ms. I and blessedhands were confusing because of the pronouns, I think.

    It seems obvious to me that no one would want their guy to cheat on them and have babies with the mistress. It doesn't seem like anything that needs to specifically be added to a list of ideal qualities...just like you wouldn't put on there, I don't want my guy to be an ex-con or a methhead. Um, of course you don't!

    It does make sense that a person might say that they don't want their guy to have children from a previous relationship. If that's an important thing to you, that could definitely be something to put on the list.

    In any event, I think that there needs to be some apologies...or at least one. The tone of one or two posts in this thread is all wrong and not what A to Z is about.
     
  37. Ms. I

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    It may seem obvious that we wouln't want that, but do you know how many guys cheat & actually get the other woman pregnant? It happens a lot.
     
  38. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    The post about agreeing with bonneb isn't the post that warrants the apology. It's this one.
     
  39. Canadian Gal

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    Non of my nieces and nephews are biologically related. They all call me Auntie.

    Some us choose are family. I chose my Dad, because my bio-Dad sucked. I am closer to my nieces and nephews then some of the biological family members, that's why I get the title of respect.
     
  40. Ms. I

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    I admit it. I was responding to the mean reply said by CG because SHE'S THE ONE WHO MISUNDERSTOOD.
     

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