Two helicopters crash in Phoenix

Discussion in 'Teacher Time Out Archives' started by Irishdave, Jul 27, 2007.

  1. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Jul 27, 2007

    Being from the Phoenx area I know this will hit the Phoenix area hard, 3 dead

    One time we had a police helicopter do a "show" at a school I was teaching at ... the next week it crashed at another school giving a "show."
    It is sad since I would sometimes contact the TV helicopters Pilots to come to my school to do talks and "shows"
     
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  3. jenglish97

    jenglish97 Devotee

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    Wow... So sorry to hear that. I was actually just reading it on the Yahoo news!
     
  4. Miss Kirby

    Miss Kirby Fanatic

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    I turned on the tv to watch some cheesy soaps and saw this instead. This is so horrible. :(
     
  5. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Down in Yuma we only get Channel 3 but I think the whole state will feel it.
    Now it is 4 dead only on the helicopters no one on the ground
     
  6. ABall

    ABall Fanatic

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    Jul 27, 2007

    I have not seen the news today, was it just today? I'm sorry to hear this.
    my husband has made parts for some of the border patrol celicopters.(the part that holds the spot light---- the guys keep using them as step ladders)
     
  7. ABall

    ABall Fanatic

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    I just put it on the all day news by cox cable and NBC
     
  8. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    This is sad..another reason why I feel car chases are just stupid!

    What happened to the people who caused this tragedy!

    I got so tired of this in L.A. Took up the whole news program.

    Sigh! Just a sad shame!
     
  9. Miss Kirby

    Miss Kirby Fanatic

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    Jul 27, 2007

    I think it just happened a couple hours ago.

    It's a blessing that it didn't hit a building or a street. I guess there were tons of kids at the park for some event this morning, and luckily no one was there this afternoon. Scary.
     
  10. WindyCityGal606

    WindyCityGal606 Enthusiast

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    I was surprised to hear that these helicopter pilots are also the reporters speaking into the camera. I really always thought someone else was in charge of the flying while the reporter did the reporting. They said that it's a hard job because they have to watch the scens and report it, check the monitors often to be able to see what their audience is seeing, and fly the helicopter and stay clear of other helicopters. That's awful!! No one should be expected to do this! My heart goes out to the whole community and the families involved.
     
  11. Miss Kirby

    Miss Kirby Fanatic

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    Yeah, talk about multitasking.

    They did have a photographer with them too though.
     
  12. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    please go back to the Caveman icon.

    You are starting to scare me.
     
  13. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Exactly my thoughts. which is why they should not be following the police who are chasing people in cars who obviously are too immature to be even driving.

    All they can think is, "Look at me, look at me."

    and that is just what everyone is doing.

    I say, if the camera man just said, "oh well, let's find a real story.", and they left, you think the idiot would stop wasting all that gas and turn himself in.
     
  14. mrs. dub

    mrs. dub Companion

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    Jul 28, 2007

    Well, both crews had a pilot and photographer on this particular day, so I'm not sure it was the one man overloaded crew that was at fault. I know many of these pilots--I worked at Sky Harbor a couple years ago where they all fuel up, and they were not crazy media guys that were just hungry for the story and the money shot. These were nice guys and they flew as safely as they could given the circumstances. According to the what was reportedly said on the frequency, it sounds like was just a tragic accident.

    On another note, I just read that the guy that was being chased may face muder charges since it may be considered the result of the chase he brought on. Some people just don't think about how their stupid decisions could effect others....

    RIP to those guys.
     
  15. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I wonder just how can the idiot who was being chased be responsible for their deaths?

    It was just a tragic accident and my payers go to thir families.
     
  16. deserttrumpet

    deserttrumpet Comrade

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    I think if we hang the man who caused the chase we are in essence doing the same thing we often complain about.
    Allowing the burglar to sue because he hurt himself while in our house
    Although he has a crime to pay for, I do not think it is right to hold him accountable for the actions of other people.
     
  17. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Because if that a**hole wasn't ripping and running in the streets in the first place, they wouldn't have been up there.

    It certainly was not their faults, and my heart goes out to their families. They were just doing their jobs, pursuing a story.

    Unlike the planes, there was no air traffic controller telling them they were getting to close. If they check the black box, I am sure it will show no pilot error, or mechanical problems.

    The idiot should face manslaughter, because he caused the accident.

    In another situation, some stupid guy decided to commit suicide by ramming his jeep into a Metrolink train in Los Angeles area, then changed his mind!

    "Two Metrolink passenger trains and a Union Pacific freight train were involved in the collision, which occurred about half a mile south of downtown Glendale. One train overturned, and the other caught fire.

    The incident is notable for its magnitude, involving two passenger trains, a freight train, and a Jeep Grand Cherokee abandoned on the tracks by Juan Manuel Alvarez. Authorities initially said Alvarez was planning to commit suicide and charged him with 11 counts of murder with "special circumstances." Police say recent investigations indicate Alvarez may have intended to cause the crash without committing suicide. Authorities have filed additional charges against him for murder with intent."

    Wikipedia
    1/26/05
    Glendale, CA


    A driver is expected to follow the rules of the road. If he deliberately breaks these rules, he knows he has the potential to cause an accident, which can lead to death.

    The minute he ran the first red light, he was guilty of any action that occured after that.
     
  18. mrs. dub

    mrs. dub Companion

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    I'm not against him being charged with manslaughter. There's no room in my heart for that criminal--I'm amazed no one on the ground or in other cars were hurt.
     
  19. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Being a constitutionalist I can not see how this low life could be charged in the deaths of the news people. This is a lynch mob mentality.
    There is no physical connection to each other, if I decide to go to the freeway to watch the pursuit and get hit crossing a street 3 blocks away could we charge the fleeing idiot?
    The News performs a service, it shows where the pursuit is so we can avoid the area, shows us our tax money being used to capture a low life , and unfortunately it gives some a source of entertainment. BUT the Fleeing low life did not put them there.

    The low life has problems that can be solved by putting his sorry (body part) in Jail for the crimes he did commit but he nor his actions caused the deaths of the newsmen.
    Besides he now has so many charges against him, he will not breath a breath of free air for decades.
     
  20. Amers

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    Jul 28, 2007

    What if one of the officers pursuing the car had crashed and died? Should the man fleeing be charged with the death of that officer? I 100% think he should. I admit, I am biassed; my fiance is a police officer.

    Look at it this way, however, if it wasn't helicopters or police hurt, and it was just another car that had to swerve out of the way and ended up dead, should the guy be charged with murder here? His actions (fleeing the police) directly lead to the death. Fleeing the police in a motor vehicle is another crime completely on top of whatever else he did. He had no regard for anyone else's safety when he made the CHOICE to run. Just my 2 cents...

    As for this situation, I was shocked when I saw it on the news last night. It's a terrible thing that happened, and I'll be keeping the families of all involved in my prayers.
     
  21. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Quote: IrishDave:


    There is no physical connection to each other, if I decide to go to the freeway to watch the pursuit and get hit crossing the street would that allow the fleeing driver to be charged?


    Yes, if you were hit by a car that swerved to get out of his way. That driver is not at fault for hitting you, he was avoiding an accident, caused by the other driver.

    Quote: Amers:

    Look at it this way, however, if it wasn't helicopters or police hurt, and it was just another car that had to swerve out of the way and ended up dead, should the guy be charged with murder here?

    Yes, for the same reason as above.

    Fleeing the police in a motor vehicle is another crime completely on top of whatever else he did. He had no regard for anyone else's safety when he made the CHOICE to run.

    I guess my point is, how else do we let these people know what they are doing is wrong, and it needs to stop?? If he is not charged, this just brings more attention to the passion of car chases. Speeding down freeways, breaking traffic laws, and running from the law is more than wrong...it is dangerous.

    They might as well tie a bomb to their backs and stand in the middle of the street.

    To let them go without any blame besides reckless driving just shows other thrillseekers what fun they can have by ruining others' lives as well.

    :2cents:
     
  22. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I fixed my statement :
     
  23. Amers

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    There is an actual law that could apply to this case. If someone is injured/killed as a result of a crime, the criminal is responsible for those injuries/deaths. I'm not phrasing it very well, but hopefully you can get the idea. I remember learning about it in an Ethics class in college. I can't remember the name of the law though. Has anyone else heard of it?
     
  24. DaveF

    DaveF Companion

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    The driver did not cause the helicopter crash. It was a lack of situational awareness from both pilots. Because they were flying under Visual Flight Rules, it is the pilots responsibility to see and avoid other aircraft.

    The crash was a result of 2 pilots trying to put their camera man in the best possible position to "get the shot." As we know, no two objects can occupy the same space at the same time. It was a very sad accident, but I do not think the scumbag on the ground caused an accident in the air. :sorry: I'm pretty sure the FAA and NTSB will agree.
     
  25. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I think it has to have a direct link to the crime, accident with the get away car or caused by get away car, a Heart attack at the robbery, Etc.
     
  26. Mrs.Gould

    Mrs.Gould Comrade

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    I just read in my local newspaper that one of the men killed was from an area less than an hour away from me. Very sad.
     
  27. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    yeah, it's just sad...I guess I have no more to say...
     
  28. Amers

    Amers Cohort

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    You're right. The more I think about it, the more I think the driver couldn't be responsible. The accident wasn't really a direct cause of the pursuit.
     

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