Student Names

Discussion in 'Substitute Teachers' started by Mr Magoo, Sep 23, 2016.

  1. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    56

    Sep 23, 2016

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
  2.  
  3. mathmagic

    mathmagic Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Messages:
    2,418
    Likes Received:
    1,175

    Sep 23, 2016

    What's wrong with having a unique name?

    It isn't meant for the initial interaction, but more-so if someone's constantly using the wrong pronunciation, which most teachers would not do since they'd get to know them.

    When I subbed, I just asked the student how they pronounced their name, so I made sure to do it as right as I could. Granted now, I leave a pronunciation guide for a sub for the tougher names.
     
    Obadiah likes this.
  4. catnfiddle

    catnfiddle Moderator

    Joined:
    May 8, 2008
    Messages:
    8,649
    Likes Received:
    1,729

    Sep 23, 2016

    In cases like this, I apologize in advance, make the best effort I can, and then (if I've goofed) apologize again for "calling the students out of name". It's usually not the first time it's happened and they're appreciative that I care enough to be semi-mortified.
     
    mckbearcat48, Obadiah and mathmagic like this.
  5. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2003
    Messages:
    6,809
    Likes Received:
    190

    Sep 23, 2016

    A family member has shown me some names.... I couldn't even try to guess them. I know there are phonemically weird spellings. Mikayla is one of those names. Lol. I have seen it spelled so many different ways. I have a name that I have seen it spelled 2 other ways besides my way but the all phonemically make sense (I guess...my way is right... ;)
     
    Obadiah likes this.
  6. dgpiaffeteach

    dgpiaffeteach Aficionado

    Joined:
    Jul 5, 2011
    Messages:
    3,224
    Likes Received:
    147

    Sep 24, 2016

    It's never bothered me if a kid has a unique name. I always give it my best try and then ask them for clarification when I need it. My last name is VERY weird looking though ultimately easy to say. It never bothers me when people get it wrong. In fact, I like hearing their guesses! It would bother me much more though if they kept doing it.
     
  7. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,250
    Likes Received:
    1,823

    Sep 24, 2016

    I don't mind unique names. I have a lot of students from different ethnic backgrounds. Often, a unique name is a cultural identifier, rather than the parent "taking bits of the alphabet out of a glass". I've had also had kids with lovely, unique names who choose to go by an Americanized version, and I think that's a shame, but I do understand it.

    The one thing that is difficult for me is if a name is spelled totally differently from how it's pronounced, when there's no reason for it. Like, if you're naming your child Jason, why spell it Jaeysinn? It just makes it unnecessarily challenging. Either way, though, it's not the kids' fault.
     
    Last edited: Sep 24, 2016
    Obadiah and DizneeTeachR like this.
  8. MrsC

    MrsC Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    Messages:
    14,067
    Likes Received:
    1,884

    Sep 24, 2016

    I always ask students to clarify for me how to pronounce their names. Nothing makes me sadder than when they say, "It doesn't matter; however you say it is okay," No. It's not okay. Everyone deserves to have their name pronounced correctly. Uncommon spellings may take me a bit to get down, but it doesn't bother me.
     
  9. ChildWhisperer

    ChildWhisperer Groupie

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,242
    Likes Received:
    431

    Sep 24, 2016

    That's just what comes with working with a specific population.
    I asked my assistant about the names (she is of their same race) and she said the parents just make them up.
    So yes, some (not all) are "poured onto paper randomly"
    I don't mind them, but I do think it is hurting their future a bit.. seeing names like that on a resume?
    How would YOU pronounce the name "Jhkdn"?!

    Ps. I'm not talking about cultural names. These are their American names
     
    otterpop likes this.
  10. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2001
    Messages:
    24,959
    Likes Received:
    2,116

    Sep 24, 2016

    This is just so sad and disrespectful. As suggested above, apologize in advance and ask the student to help you pronounce his/her name correctly.
     
  11. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,250
    Likes Received:
    1,823

    Sep 24, 2016

    Names are really important. My name is not too different (actually, it's fairly common), but it does get misspelled often and sometimes mispronounced right after I've introduced myself, and it drives me nuts. For me, it shows inattention to detail. Take the few seconds to get it right. Whether the name is standard or not is not really important. Just figure out how to say it or spell it right; it shows the person that you value them. This all reminds me of an article that I read awhile ago:

    http://www.pbs.org/newshour/rundown...ng-a-students-name-can-have-a-lasting-impact/
     
  12. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,250
    Likes Received:
    1,823

    Sep 24, 2016

    Oh... one practical thought in case it's of any value...

    When I have a name that I have a hard time remembering how to pronounce, or a nickname that the student goes by, I just make a quick note on the roster. Spell it phonetically if needed. That way you have it to refer to and there's no confusion.
     
    Obadiah and DizneeTeachR like this.
  13. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2003
    Messages:
    6,809
    Likes Received:
    190

    Sep 24, 2016

    I had a last name that looks a lot like another word and people mispronounce it. So when I subbed I would tell students it is like this minus one letter. One time at a store I heard a child using the rhyming word as my last name....guess it worked that way too. Lol.
     
  14. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    29,799
    Likes Received:
    1,167

    Sep 24, 2016

    Mispronouncing a name initially isn't a micro-aggression. Electing not to take the student's word for how that student's name is pronounced, however, is.
     
  15. yellowdaisies

    yellowdaisies Fanatic

    Joined:
    Feb 7, 2011
    Messages:
    2,653
    Likes Received:
    233

    Sep 25, 2016

    I teach in a very diverse area with many different cultural groups. We have many children at our school whose names are at first difficult for me to pronounce. I make it my goal to get the pronunciation correct. I believe that it's imperative for me to do this as a teacher and out of respect for the students and the students' cultures.
     
  16. Obadiah

    Obadiah Groupie

    Joined:
    Jul 27, 2015
    Messages:
    1,356
    Likes Received:
    844

    Sep 25, 2016

    I think it's important to learn the correct pronunciation of a kid's name. For names of students from other countries, some of the phonemes will be different than English phonemes, and it takes careful listening. Sometimes the student will say in an effort to be courteous to me that I pronounced it correctly when I'm still uncertain of some of the phonemes, and I'll assure the student that I'm very interested in learning the correct pronunciation. This sets a good example for the students. In a multicultural classroom, I believe it's important for kids to learn correct foreign phonemic awareness; elementary students are still at an especially capable age for doing so and teenagers are at an age of linguistic brain growth. They're brains are programmed to align with local pronunciations, which is good--it's how the brain functions linguistically--but their brain is also geared to learn new pronunciations as needed.
     
    DizneeTeachR likes this.
  17. Leaborb192

    Leaborb192 Enthusiast

    Joined:
    Jun 18, 2016
    Messages:
    2,407
    Likes Received:
    1,180

    Sep 25, 2016

    It gets kind of annoying. People frequently misspell or pronounce my last name (it's anglicized from French) and even after I have explicitly stated it, they still mess up.
    :(:down:
     
  18. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2001
    Messages:
    24,959
    Likes Received:
    2,116

    Sep 25, 2016

    Are your mispronunciations typically involving names of minority students or those of marginalized groups?
     
  19. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    56

    Sep 25, 2016

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
  20. ChildWhisperer

    ChildWhisperer Groupie

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,242
    Likes Received:
    431

    Sep 25, 2016

    I don't think it matters if you pronounce it wrong the first time. Just make a note of it and get it right the next time
     
    MrsC likes this.
  21. TeacherNY

    TeacherNY Maven

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,537
    Likes Received:
    1,714

    Sep 26, 2016

    That's what I was thinking. We can't know how to pronounce EVERY name. When I was subbing one time a student's name was Marquis. I pronounced it Mar-kee. Wouldn't you? I was THEN told (with a very insolent tone) it was pronounced Mar-Kus. OK, I'm not a mind reader!
    I did make a student happy one time when I pronounced her name of Siobhan correctly. She thanked me several times since nobody ever got it right.
     
  22. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    56

    Sep 26, 2016

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
  23. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2007
    Messages:
    14,601
    Likes Received:
    2,710

    Sep 26, 2016

    Clemente and Clementine are two different names. That isn't a pronunciation issue.

    [​IMG]
     
  24. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Jun 10, 2007
    Messages:
    14,601
    Likes Received:
    2,710

    Sep 26, 2016

    Sometimes there are multiple accepted pronunciations for the same name. That's why it's important to listen to how each kid says his or her own name.

    [​IMG]
     
  25. ms.irene

    ms.irene Connoisseur

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    743

    Sep 26, 2016

    My first name is common in the US, but when I lived in France, it stumped most people. I accepted whatever pronunciation people came up with and even thought it was fun to go by the French version, but then, I was there for a cultural experience, not a teenager trying to fit in. I think part of being a teacher today is being open and willing to try to pronounce students' names the way the student wants their name to be said.
     
  26. TeacherNY

    TeacherNY Maven

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,537
    Likes Received:
    1,714

    Sep 26, 2016

    I don't think anyone is saying you have to 100% pronounce it correctly the first time you encounter the name. We are human and make mistakes. As long as you correct it for next time I doubt anyone will fault you. Also, maybe if you're unsure to begin with just ask. Or, go down the rows asking who they are and then find their names to check them off. Then they will pronounce it the way they want it and you don't have to waste time with guessing games. I think there are more important things to get to in class and I can't see spending too much time on it.
     
    ms.irene likes this.
  27. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

    Joined:
    May 13, 2005
    Messages:
    29,799
    Likes Received:
    1,167

    Sep 26, 2016

    Like TeacherNY's Siobhán, I'm philosophical about people getting my names wrong on the first try and gratified when they get them right - though speakers of English generally find my names less difficult, once explained. I learned decades ago to accept a certain range of mispronunciation from people I don't expect to deal with again. Only one of my teachers ever took more than a couple of days to get it right, and that was the one I gave up on after three weeks of increasingly exotic mispronunciations: in retrospect, I wonder whether dyslexia mightn't have been one of his issues (though that still didn't excuse his persistence in error).

    Reading Clementine for Clemente is odd: for one thing, Clementine is pretty well known to be a girl's name, even in the standard American English pronunciation with long I, and I am willing to wager that young Clemente was male. There's also the matter of the extra N at the end of Clementine. Together with the opening reference to unfamiliar names resembling alphabet letters randomly scattered, this level of inattention leaves me impressed, but not favorably.
     
    czacza likes this.
  28. ChildWhisperer

    ChildWhisperer Groupie

    Joined:
    Jun 25, 2015
    Messages:
    1,242
    Likes Received:
    431

    Sep 26, 2016

    Right! That's a reading issue! They are totally different names.
     
    SpecialPreskoo likes this.
  29. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2001
    Messages:
    24,959
    Likes Received:
    2,116

    Sep 26, 2016

    No kidding. A micro aggression is by definition against minorities or marginalized groups. Your comment about bits of the alphabet mixed in a glass is disrespectful and if those names tend to belong to such groups, it kind of just makes it worse.
     
    dgpiaffeteach likes this.
  30. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    56

    Sep 26, 2016

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
  31. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Sep 30, 2001
    Messages:
    24,959
    Likes Received:
    2,116

    Sep 27, 2016

    Never heard of Roberto Clemente. Or San Clemente. Or noticed that Clementine ends in 'tine' as in 'Oh, my darlin' Clementine' :confused:
     
    SpecialPreskoo likes this.
  32. SpecialPreskoo

    SpecialPreskoo Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2002
    Messages:
    5,119
    Likes Received:
    481

    Sep 28, 2016

    It might be a processing thing. My para has trouble with pronunciation of words. Geography - she pronounced it like GEE-O-GRAF-EE when she saw it on paper. Even after hearing me read it in the lesson she still couldn't pronounce it. That is just one of MANY words.
     
  33. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,250
    Likes Received:
    1,823

    Sep 28, 2016



    This video cracks me up... warning, does have some minor swearing.
     
    Caesar753 and SpecialPreskoo like this.
  34. Mr Magoo

    Mr Magoo Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2016
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    56

    Sep 28, 2016

    .
     
    Last edited: Feb 25, 2017
  35. cupcakequeen

    cupcakequeen Comrade

    Joined:
    Sep 10, 2014
    Messages:
    276
    Likes Received:
    63

    Sep 28, 2016

    Once I took my husband's hard to pronounce last name I developed a lot more sympathy for kids with names that get messed up a lot. I know it's frustrating to me (and my last name is only 4 letters, one syllable, and even rhymes with an easy to remember word) that only about 25% of my colleagues say my name correctly even after being told several times. Many of them just don't use my new name at all and continue to call me by my maiden name, and seem embarrassed to ask how to say it correctly. That annoys me a little.

    I absolutely do not mind others asking, or even asking more than once, and I appreciate that they want to know what the correct pronunciation is.

    I will say that my kids have picked up on my name much faster than adults- that surprised me!
     
  36. SpecialPreskoo

    SpecialPreskoo Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2002
    Messages:
    5,119
    Likes Received:
    481

    Sep 28, 2016

    Oh my... I'm dying!!!!
     
  37. SpecialPreskoo

    SpecialPreskoo Moderator

    Joined:
    Jul 19, 2002
    Messages:
    5,119
    Likes Received:
    481

    Sep 28, 2016

     
  38. ms.irene

    ms.irene Connoisseur

    Joined:
    Sep 7, 2010
    Messages:
    1,564
    Likes Received:
    743

    Sep 28, 2016

    OMG so I have "calling cards" in my class to pick students for groupings, and sometimes I let students pick the cards and read the names. I actually did have a student read the name "Blake" as "Black-ey"! Luckily "Black-ey" had a great sense of humor and it became a running joke. The struggle is real...
     
  39. phillyteacher

    phillyteacher Comrade

    Joined:
    Jul 28, 2015
    Messages:
    284
    Likes Received:
    124

    Sep 28, 2016

    After similar experiences my very first year of teaching (and, to a lesser extent, in later years), I have learned not to try to pronounce a name that I can tell may be tricky until I have heard students say it at least once. Then I write it down phonetically for myself and practice it.

    Strategies to avoid saying names before hearing them:
    • "Oh my, I'm not sure how to pronounce this next name and I want to get it right - K... A..." and so on, spelling it out until the students tell me
    • Have students introduce themselves in a quick pop up game
    • Have a student who appears trustworthy read the name(s) for me
    • If I am saying the name and I still feel uncertain, I just ask the student if I'm saying it right and ask that they correct me if I get it wrong because I really want to get it right
     
    otterpop likes this.
  40. RussianBlueMommy

    RussianBlueMommy Comrade

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2016
    Messages:
    441
    Likes Received:
    164

    Sep 29, 2016

    I get both sides. In my subbing experience, I wonder how on earth some parents came up with names. Had a child the other day in high school. No kidding, her name was Precious-Angel. Spelled just like that...I get wanting a unique name, but seriously think about how hard it might be to pronounce.
     
  41. RussianBlueMommy

    RussianBlueMommy Comrade

    Joined:
    Apr 15, 2016
    Messages:
    441
    Likes Received:
    164

    Sep 29, 2016

    Ha! Reminds me of this video...
     

Share This Page

Members Online Now

Total: 100 (members: 0, guests: 88, robots: 12)
test