somebody lied to me... long...

Discussion in 'General Education' started by sk8enscars311, Jan 9, 2009.

  1. sk8enscars311

    sk8enscars311 Companion

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    Jan 9, 2009

    Okay..... let's play mythbusters.

    All my life I've heard how you can take legal action if someone so much as lays a finger on you. Especially in school where they scare the crap out of you about physical contact with your kids (pat on the back type stuff.)

    I'm sure some are familiar with my husband's situation in the rough school. He's still there and we're still complaining... sorry! But things will be changing in a week so he's going to stick it out.

    Anyway, dh has a student named *Milly* who acts like dh has brought the wrath of hell down on her. She will glare at him any time she gets and cusses him out. He just smiles and waves and says "HI MILLY!" really cheerful. Ticks her off. Anyway, one day in the cafeteria she had something she wasn't something to have so he goes up to her and asks for it. Of course she doesn't give it. So he blocks her path. She cusses more and shoves into him to get by. He lets VP know and VP sends her home for the next few days. Just the other day dh covered the computer class for another teacher and was annoyed to find Milly in the class. The kids were supposed to be doing a math quiz and instead Milly is looking at myspace and watching music videos. Dh walks by and reaches down to her keyboard to hit the key code that closes all windows (something + F4?) She grabs his wrist and shoves it away shouting "BOY YOU BETTER GO SOMEWHERE!!" He has four numbers for the girl, all leading to a dead end. So he turned in the referral marking that he couldn't reach anyone. VP finds the referral in his box this morning while my husband was there. He pulls it out and hands it right back to him saying "You can't turn this in saying you can't reach the parents.. call her mom." Dh explained the phone situation and he basically brushed him off. Other teachers at his school were surprised about what he deals with and urged him to take it to the cop stationed at the school.

    He goes to the cop and they tell him there's nothing he can do since here intent was not to harm him. WHAT???? They even used the example of if he's blocking a door and student wants by, he can shove my husband and my husband can't press charges because the student was not intending harm but just wanting by. Funny enough this exact situation played out an hour later. Dh was told by VP to not let anyone out during lunch so he stands in front of the door. Student comes and shoves him through the door. Luckily they were in a foyer (without cameras) where my husband then shoved the kid against the wall, pinned him there with his chest and got in his face and told him how it was. I was so happy to hear this. Dh needed that so bad.... The kid scampered off with his tail between his legs.

    Anyway.... did anyone else have this same misconception about the definition of assault and all that??? There needs to more PD about teacher rights and all that.
     
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  3. Jem

    Jem Aficionado

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    Jan 9, 2009

    I had a student twist my wrist really, really hard when I tried to take her cell phone away. She went to hand it to me, and when I had it in my hand, she twisted. Then she started screaming into the phone, which was still in use and connected to her mother, that I was stealing her phone, all the while twisting my wrist and arm like there was no tomorrow.

    Nothing happened.

    Rough schools suck at discipline. That's why the kids do that stuff-they know they can get away with it.

    (can you tell I'm a bit bitter??)
     
  4. DallasTeacher

    DallasTeacher Companion

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    Jan 9, 2009

    It's the school's call. I had a special ed student just barely make physical contact with his hand to my shoulder in the hallway when he wanted by, and not only was he charged with a Class C Misdemeanor, but was sent to alternative school for 60 days. Our campus take ANY physical contact in anger/disagreement/agression from to student to a teacher very seriously. In fact, we had a student throw and hit a teacher with a spit wad and he was ticketed with the same Class C Misdemeanor and sent to alternative school for 60 days. I guess it just all depends on the administration's position.

    We could definitely be a rough school as we were built as a "relief" campus and the campus our 1100 kids came from had many assults on teachers by students. Zero tolerance!
     
  5. catsos2

    catsos2 Companion

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    Jan 9, 2009

    I'm confused to why the intent would be the determining factor...?

    If a kid pushed your husband in order to get through the door and in turn your husband fell and broke his arm, would it be different? The kid doesn't mean to break his arm, but he caused your husband to fal... Those rules don't make sense to me at all.

    I agree with the previous posters, too - it does not seem that this administrator is interested in deterring this type of behavior. I would encourage your husband to document every incident with this girl and elevate it to the principal or even further if the VP does not take action.
     
  6. EMonkey

    EMonkey Connoisseur

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    Jan 9, 2009

    Maybe your husband needs to contact the city police instead of the school police or the administration.

    I would also suggest he ask the administrator why he/she is asking that he blocks doorways if the admin is not willing to support teachers who are pushed out of the way of the student. It seems the fact the child is pushing upon being specifically told not to has nothing to do with going through a door but rather is a refusal to follow direct instructions and choosing to potentially injure/assault a public service worker in the process. That is definitely against the law.

    It is against the law in the state of California to assault or purposefully injure a teacher (public service worker). It is also in the ed code in California that if an administrator tries to stop a teacher from reporting a student to the police it is a misdemeanor. I would be surprised if other states do not have laws that in some way are similar.
     
  7. Hoot Owl

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    Jan 10, 2009

    This is child tyranny and tragic.
     
  8. MrsPatten

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    Jan 12, 2009

    This reminds me of a situation I was in when I was a long term sub in Kdg. There was this girl in my class who was extremely defiant. Three days before school was out for summer she hit me. Her "punishment" was being suspended for two days. As a result she got to start summer vacation before everyone else. Kind of ridiculous if you ask me...
     
  9. 3Sons

    3Sons Enthusiast

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    Jan 12, 2009

    Okay, there's a lot of misconceptions here, let's start:

    Battery is intentionally touching someone in a way a reasonable person would find harmful or offensive, assault is making someone believe they're about to be touched in such a way.

    Intent is important in the act -- if you bump into someone in the subway accidentally, it's not battery.

    Police, however, have some discretion in enforcing criminal law, and often won't unless they get a lot of pressure. My guess is the cop in your school wasn't interested in getting into a precedent of pressing charges for each teacher who was shoved. Additionally, states get to define their criminal law, and may make harm a part of the requirement for criminal battery.

    This doesn't mean it's not a civil offense, and your husband could sue the kid and his parents in civil court. So, there are legal actions you could take. The question is whether it's actually worth it to take them.

    Your husband likely has some street cred at this point. Note that if there had been cameras and the kid had tried to have your husband sued/arrested, there are legal defenses -- self-defense being the most obvious of these. Milly actually has the self-defense argument also. Next time, he should just unplug the PC.

    The school also has to work out how much physical force is allowed with the students.

    edit: Checking on the DC criminal code here, it is particularly unfriendly to people who just get pushed, slapped, or punched -- generally requiring an intent to at least disfigure (22-401, 402, and 403 are what the cop meant by "intent", I'll bet) or for there to be some other aggravating circumstance.



    disclaimer: I am not a qualified attorney in the District of Columbia, none of this should be taken as formal legal advice, and you are not my client. If you need legal advice, you should seek out an attorney licensed in the District of Columbia.
     
    Last edited: Jan 12, 2009

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