Sad times for Penn State - Grand Jury Report

Discussion in 'Teacher Time Out' started by Major, Nov 8, 2011.

  1. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    Got to feel pity (an understatement) for the 10-12 year old boys who were (allegedly) sexually assaulted by this former coach. Very disappointing that the powerful men --- in positions of authority --- didn't immediately report the (alleged) rapes to law enforcement...:(

    http://media.centredaily.com/smedia/2011/11/07/17/52/togjq.So.42.pdf
     
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  3. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    I only read a couple... just disgusting!!!!

    I feel for Coach Joe... I mean he did report it to who he thought would take care of it...
     
  4. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    Just came back from a long run expecting to see Joe Pa's press conference.......... only to find out the PSU president (Spanier) cancelled it. I've always been a Joe Pa fan (not necessarily a PSU fan) ........ I don't see him coming out of this untarnished.......

    And now as I type ESPN is reporting that the NY Times says PSU is planning Joe Pa's "exit."
     
  5. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    I saw something that said he should have done more.... I guess when you report something you would hope the "uppers" would do what they say they are going to do.

    It's just sad if he leaves or forced to, to go out like this....
     
  6. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    I don't. Nor do I feel for the graduate assistant, or the janitor, or any other Penn State official. The acts that they witnessed, or were told about, are illegal, heinous, and inexcusable. I can understand initially reporting it to your immediate supervisor, but once it is clear action is not taken, ALL of them should have gone to police. The report states that all of these witnesses were distraught-but the grad assistant still works on the coaching staff. The officials (were) still employed by Penn State. JoePa still had contact with that monster.

    And none of them, over many years, ever told police. Shameful.
     
  7. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    I agree with you on all counts. If you or I had witnessed these acts and done nothing more than report them to our principals, we wouldn't be fulfilling our obligation as mandated reporters and we'd be subject to termination, not to mention the fact that we'd basically be complicit in the abuse itself.

    I've always had a special place in my heart for Joe Paterno because he studied Latin back in the day. Still, I think he did the wrong thing by not making sure that law enforcement or CPS or some real entity was made aware of what he witnessed. The whole situation makes me sick and I feel so bad for the kids involved.
     
  8. Cerek

    Cerek Aficionado

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    :yeahthat:


    I agree on all counts.

    Reporting the incident to our principals wouldn't be sufficient for us, so it certainly shouldn't have been sufficient at the college level. I know Paterno was torn about reporting the incident because he and Sandusky were such good friends and I can't help wondering if he "reported" it to his superior as a basic CYA action while knowing nothing would actually be done about it.

    Even if that isn't the case, once he saw admin was NOT following through, HE had an obligation to those boys to report it to the proper authorities himself. He might have lost a friend, but he would have lived up to the integrity everyone else expects from him.
     
  9. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    Totally agree. It's shameful.

    Our local news did a full front page editorial call for Spanier and Paterno's exit, which is rare for a paper to do, obviously.
     
  10. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    It's more than shameful....... At least four adults, in positions of authority, didn't morally follow through with their obligations and notify law enforcement. I'll bet that quite a few other adults (perhaps Spanier? ) also knew of the alleged assaults/rapes.

    And it's inconceivable that Sandusky would be allowed back on the campus for all these years.
     
  11. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    Silver, was that the one with the big pic of JoePa and the word "Shame"? I saw that on ESPN.
     
  12. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    Exactly Major. Were not talking about something that happened (well at least began) recently. This started years ago. The level of failure of so many is abhorrent.
     
  13. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    KC... I agree... I just think it's sad that he did report it...

    We don't know all the circumstances... so I don't want to judge early. I just think you do what you're should and hopefully it's taken care of... but if it's not you need to step up as well.

    I was also thinking about this from a different view maybe the alleged people told Joe we are getting help ....blah, blah...like an addict would... Not that it's an excuse, but who knows....
     
  14. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    While this is not germane to this thread.... many of my in-laws are Penn State grads...... and they are devastated by the recent Happy Valley revelations...... and I feel for them. I don't have much family left so through the years my in-laws have become my "blood" relatives. Despite this I was never a big PSU fan...... but I always admired Joe Pa........ I'm very disappointed that he didn't do more with the moral obligation part...... :(
     
  15. Cerek

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  16. Maryhf

    Maryhf Connoisseur

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    I am one of those sad lions. Undergrad and grad work at University Park. My DS is currently a student.the situation has nothing to do with the current students, yet it now has everything to do with them. They walk past national press on the way to class. My son was questioned by USA Today and turned down the interview. The situation is deplorable. The President must go and there must be a clean house in the athletic department. I always loved JoePa and all he stood for - or did he? I am troubled by the moral obligation to report and then follow up which didn't happen. I as saddened that 2 employees of the university witnessed heinous acts and didn't charge in and kill the man right on the spot! And the lies! In PA, the failure to report charge is very minor - but the 2 officials who are charged will be punished more because they lied to the grand jury. At least Paterno told the AG the truth.
    I got a great education. But everything else I believed to be true about honor and success were lies. The last stanza of my alma mater:
    May no act of ours bring shame
    To one heart that loves thy name,
    May our lives but swell thy fame,
    Dear old State, dear old State.
     
  17. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    Cerek...thanks for sharing...
    It is just sad all around... praying for the kids & their families. Prayers for the families that have are attending, have attended this college!!!
     
  18. Maryhf

    Maryhf Connoisseur

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    We just used to be the college who won "best party school" awards, but was beyond reproach morally. An era has ended and will never be the same. And those poor boys...
     
  19. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    No, this one actually had no pictures. It looked like a letter on the front page. I actually pulled it aside to show journalism students tomorrow as it is kind of rare. Here is a pic. http://www.newseum.org/todaysfrontpages/hr.asp?fpVname=PA_PN&ref_pge=gal&b_pge=1

    (totally unrelated - newseum archives front pages of papers and you can search by state - great resource).
     
  20. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    Mary, I'm so sorry for you and all the others associated with PSU. I too admired JoePa in the world of college football. We here in Nebraska love and admire our coaches, so I know how one can be elevated in public stature, and the devastation must be horrible. But, as we know, with elevated status comes extra responsibility to be that pillar of morality...oh, why, would they do this? It makes me angry! I pray for peace for the families, and the Penn State community...
     
  21. MissAnt

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    One of the issues is Pennsylvania's mandated reporter law is very lax. I believe JoePa technically fulfilled his duty (legally, though not morally). The law requires that an administrator be notified of any incident and then THEY make the choice whether or not to report the incident to law enforcement.

    Sad that it takes such a horrific occurrence to change these laws. Anyone remember the Delaware pediatrician? Laws were only changed after 100+ children were victimized.
     
  22. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    Yep, and sadly, even BEFORE that, Delaware's laws were stronger than PA's about reporting.

    I can't believe the students are supporting him like they are. Football over safety of kids. :dizzy:
     
  23. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    Looks like his career is over - he asked to retire before next year. Now they are debating whether they are even going to let him stay that long.
     
  24. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    It was probably time for him to retire awhile ago...just too bad he has to go out with all this...
     
  25. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    At least four grown men (probably many more) at Penn State knew a child had been molested on the PSU campus years ago. Through their inaction countless boys (we will probably never know how many) were molested/raped/sodomized.... by a monster.

    Penn State needs to clean house very quickly before they can begin to rebuild their stellar reputation.


    EDIT: Make that five grown men..... Forgot to throw the PSU president, Spanier...... in the group.....
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2011
  26. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    For the record I don't hate JoePa....... but I strongly believe that if he (JoePa) was told by the grad assistant........ that he saw something "inappropriate" happen in the shower between Sandusky and a ten year old boy ....... then JoePa should have taken charge of the situation...... and that goes far beyond just reporting the event to his superiors....... He should have followed through to see that law enforcement was made aware of the situation........ and as far as I know he didn't do this......... Why didn't he? Was protecting PSU football more important than the possible molestation of a young boy?

    There are lots of victims here....... but none are employed by PSU.

    Peace......... just saying what I feel.......... Major......
     
  27. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    I agree with Major here - not hating on JoePa but taking in every piece of the story, they just need to clean house.

    http://www.latimes.com/sports/la-sp-1110-plaschke-joe-paterno-20111109,0,7343444.column?track=rss Good editorial.
     
  28. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    Thanks for posting that, silver........ Everyone should read this editorial.........

    "If only Paterno had shown this same compassionate concern for a 10-year-old boy who was allegedly sexually assaulted in his football team's showers."

    I've been a life long jock...... Played football from Jr. High all the way through College...... Football was my life..... but I think football has now moved down a notch or two....... Again peace....... Major
     
  29. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Ummm, I'm not in charge of a multimillion dollar sports program, but I do know to whom one reports suspicion of abuse. Shame on ALL who knew something and relied on others to do the right thing.
     
  30. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    I'm not saying he was in the right...
    But how many times have we said something to someone to do something and it wasn't done...Yes, I'm sure we would all follow through with it...

    But like you said you're not in charge of a multimillion dollar sports program... so why wouldn't you think that things were handled. I'm not saying he should have done more follow up....

    I'm not trying to be evil or that I don't agree that is should have been handled differently, better and I'm sure in hindsite (which is always better) they are all kicking themselves and doing the "I should'ves..."

    I don't agree with what was covered up and what went on, but I'm not the judge.... I think it is horrible that this all went on & feel for those who were victims and their families.
     
  31. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    Based on everything I've read, I have a hard time believing that all these adults accidentally dropped the ball. The whole situation smacks of a cover up from the beginning.

    I mean, come on. You've got accusations of an adult man being inappropriate with what appears to be a pre-teen boy in the showers, and the best solution you can come up with is to tell the adult man that he can't shower with kids anymore? Really??

    I don't believe for one second that all these people who knew or heard about the terrible goings-on were even a fraction as stupid as they would have to be to think that these things were okay or that someone else would take care of the problem. These people were highly paid professionals in jobs of tremendous power. They should have known better, and in fact I believe that they DID know better but chose to turn a blind eye. I hope that this school cleans house.
     
  32. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    I think I would be more understanding if this was something that happened recently. But this particular incident was nine years ago. That is a looong time to sit on that information. Especially when it should have been abundantly clear that something was amiss.

    I hate to see a respected man's career come to this kind of end. But, actions (or in this case, inactions) have consequences. JoePa carefully crafted his image for the last half century-and after this nightmare, I, for one, don't think it could be resurrected in another 50 years.
     
  33. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    Geesh... I'm done... I am not defending any of their actions...but simply trying to think about the situation. Things were done SO WRONG on so many accounts!!!!

    I will leave now... and just go on praying for those victims & everyone involved! It's a nightmare for all involved I'm sure!!!
     
  34. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    No, no Diz, don't leave...you have your opinion just like everyone else! I didn't mean to be jumping on you, I was just responding to the thread in general. I've been thinking about this a lot today because it bothers me so. I would be devastated if it came out that Bob Devaney or Tom Osborne was involved in such a scandal, I can only imagine what those in Happy Valley are experiencing. Tragic.

    :hugs:
     
  35. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    Someone just reminded me that Jerry Sandusky was the guest speaker at our opening day for my district the first year I worked here in PA. I didn't remember because I didn't know anything about PSU football then. Ug.
     
  36. MissAnt

    MissAnt Comrade

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    Spanier and Paterno have been fired, effective immediately.
     
  37. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    With power and position also comes responsibility...which was severely lacking in this situation.
     
  38. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    Wow. Just...wow. I am awed by the events of this evening. I don't even know what to say.
     
  39. stephenpe

    stephenpe Connoisseur

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    A young girl (at school) came to me and said her step father was bothering her. I called the number for child abuse or DCF and they came that morning to interview her. I never saw her again until 15 years later. She was a nurse in a hospital. She saw me and her first words were "you saved my life". I have no idea what happened with PSU or Joe Pa. The last person you ever thought would be touched by scandal is this guy. Im not giving him a pass but we dont know the whole story beyond some predator abused some boys. My best friend drinks himself to death all the time because (he says) an uncle abused him and his siblings quite a bit and their parents did not protect them.
    I look at pedophiles like rabid dogs. We need to protect the innocents at all costs.
     
  40. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Amen.
     
  41. Cerek

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    Nov 10, 2011

    While we don't know everything that happened and was done - or was NOT done - at the time of the allegations, it certainly LOOKS like a "team effort" to just cover up the actions, do a little (very little) internal discipline and sweep the whole thing under the rug in hopes that it will just go away on it's own.....and it did for several years.

    Still haven't heard why the allegations are coming out now (who reported the information and what prompted them to do it), but it sure looks like Penn State tried to just handle it very quietly in hopes that it would never surface and tarnish the reputation of Paterno, the football program or the university.

    On a more positive note, the Board of Trustees DID "clean house" last night and have fired everyone involved, with the exception of Mike McQuery(sp?), who was the grad assistant that initially reported the incident and now has a higher position with the university.
     

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