P'd Beyond Belief

Discussion in 'High School' started by Soccer Dad, May 21, 2010.

  1. Samothrace

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    May 24, 2010

    I'm just glad that this student had a teacher in the building they felt safe enough, trusted enough, and felt supported by to go to them. She could have easily kept the incident to herself...resulting in more problems for her.

    I hope the horrible experience makes her a stronger individual and one that in looking back on as an adult she can find the good in the bad and what she took away from the situation.
     
  2. Soccer Dad

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    May 24, 2010

    The parents had talked to other parents over the weekend and were informed of past discrepencies regarding this teacher and her remarks. They then went the Superintendent with this knowledge and he took the matter very seriously (from what I know, of course).

    The district has placed her in a "rubber room." Additionally, the district's lawyers are consulting with the family.

    My department chair has already made arrangements to keep this teacher with a minimal schedule next year: 9th grade global history and 10th grade Euro. Hopefully, if she does stay, she won't be "tempted" to share her opinion on matters seeing as how her curriculum is much more concrete.

    I was talked to my the Superintendent today. They did confirm everything the girl said, everything the teacher said, and everything I said.

    I have no idea how the teaching is acting now or what she's saying about the matter.
     
  3. Soccer Dad

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    May 24, 2010

    First of all, this was her first year. I made mistakes too my first year. However, I learned from them. I'm going to bet a lot that most teachers you talk to will say the same. However, this teacher has had several issues from the first month of school until now. Clearly, someone's not learning from their mistakes. At this point, I think it's time the district wises up and fires her. I don't think that's vicious. I think it's common sense. Teachers should be held to the same standards as any other workers in any other industry. If you mess up enough, it comes with consequences. When you refuse to learn from those mistakes, firing is the consequences. Unfortunately, the mistake isn't coming to work late... no, it's make students cry and embarassing them in front of their peers.

    Second off, I would never remark about a student's sexuality in the classroom. If a student told me they were comfortable talking about it themselves, I'd open the floor to them. I know that some teachers are fine with hearing stories from students about another student. I don't agree with that, but hey that's just me. So even if she didn't "out" her on purpose, that's no reason to let it enter into the discussion without having the girl's consent beforehand.

    And, everything the girl said was confirmed by students in the class, the teacher herself, and by me.
     
  4. Cerek

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    May 25, 2010

    Kidding students about "daydreaming about boys" or being a "ladies man" is completely different from saying "Ok, we heard from a lesbian. Next we'll hear from a straight person."

    What if I were discussing slavery in the classroom and called on an African-American student, then said "Alright, we heard from a black student. Next, we'll have a white student give us a different perspective."?

    I'm certainly not "outing" the first student as black, but I am being grossly insensitive and ignorant. I think most all the members here can agree my job would be in serious jeapordy - and rightly so.
     
  5. blindteacher

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    May 25, 2010

    It doesn't even matter if she is "out" or not. Using her sexuality to put her on the spot in a same-sex marriage debate is inappropriate. If she wills it herself, that's one thing, but to put her on the spot is another thing entirely. It obviously made her feel uncomfortable.

     
  6. blindteacher

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    May 25, 2010

    I can tell you if a teacher ever did this to me, it would make me extremely uncomfortable.
     
  7. Brendan

    Brendan Fanatic

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    May 25, 2010

    That would be grossly inappropriate.
     
  8. Cerek

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    May 25, 2010

    Precisely. This situation is grossly inappropriate for the same reason.
     
  9. Soccer Dad

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    May 25, 2010

    The girl came back to school today. Although all the kids in her grade (12th) were supportive--even rallying behind her--the freshmen baseball team had a field day with it. She ended up leaving school early--the team's now suspended.

    Although the teacher doesn't control the actions of the baseball team, she facilitated that harassment and now, again, I'm ticked off.

    Now, I'm going to outwardly say: She needs to be FIRED, CANNED, DISMISSED, whatever you care to call it.
     
  10. scholarteacher

    scholarteacher Connoisseur

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    May 25, 2010

    I'm shocked as well, and yes, the teacher was way out of line. I'd fear for my job if I said something like that. On the other hand, that seems like a subject that doesn't need to be in a school classroom. Better left discussed at home!
     
  11. DizneeTeachR

    DizneeTeachR Virtuoso

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    May 25, 2010

    That stinks that the team did that... although it is a bunch of probably immature boys!!! I'm glad they took some drastic action!!!

    It could have all been avoided if the teacher would have thought about it before saying what she did.

    Scholarteacher... they are high school... so I think debating it is ok, but bringing somebody's personal sexuality into is a whole 'nother thing!!!
     
  12. catnfiddle

    catnfiddle Moderator

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    May 25, 2010

    I'm sure the baseball team felt it was okay to make comments because the teacher was able to do so without consequence. I'm also sure that's something that will be raised by the players' parents.

    Nobody asked. She didn't tell. Please don't assume and PLEASE don't presume to broadcast your opinions on such matters, Ms. Government Teacher.
     
  13. indigo-angel

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    May 25, 2010

    :) Well I guess everyone "told"me. First, I never condoned her actions (re-read my post). Second, I just stated that I believe what was done in response to her was over the top. I believe that it's more than just professional; I think there's a lot of personal resentment toward the Govt. teacher that's the catalyst behind this.

    Now that we know she is a first year teacher and not a tenured one, and a teacher in a field (social science) that is overly saturated in many areas, I find it even harder to believe that all of these steps needed to be taken to have her gone.

    Again, that's my opinion, I'm not looking for an argument.
     
  14. indigo-angel

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    May 25, 2010

    In my post I said that the two didn't equate. I was just making the point that sexuality isn't an issue when a person is straight. If a teacher said to a gay student that he's daydreaming about a boy, that is deemed inapproriate, but the same thing said to a gir is not. And I'm just bringing this up in response to the idea(s) that students' sexuality is never brought up in class. I think that people are often harsh in their judgement of others without realizing their own actions.
     
  15. indigo-angel

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    May 25, 2010

    About the firing: I think that is reasonable. It is clear that she has done and said things that indicate she is not a good fit for the school or district. This happens all the time. What I think is vicious is the law suit business and going to the superintendent.

    I already replied to someone else about the sexuality in the classroom thing
     
  16. msmullenjr

    msmullenjr Devotee

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    May 25, 2010

    I agree that she should be fired because if she makes no effort to acknowledge her mistakes (certainly no effort to fix them) she should not be in the classroom. You cannot compare straight comments (boy crazy) to gay comments. People aren't beat up, made fun of, or tortured for being straight so that is not even a logical argument. Before this teacher is given tenure, she should be let go. Period.
     
  17. Brendan

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    May 25, 2010

    In any other workplace this person would have been fired on the spot. This is sexual harassment, not simple making mistakes, any adult should know not do this. She deserves to be booted right out the door.
     
  18. Soccer Dad

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    May 25, 2010

    Well, first off, I said the parents should mention the term lawyers IF the district doesn't do its job. As far as I know, they are. However, this teacher deserves to be fired and if a lawsuit is needed to do that, then so be it.

    I think it's vicious to make a student cry, ESPECIALLY after having sit downs after prior issues.

    And if it's vicious of me to stand up for my students against a teacher that has already tried to hide behind race, then I accept it.
     
  19. indigo-angel

    indigo-angel Companion

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    May 25, 2010

    Did you even get my argument? I was making the point that sexuality is brought up often in the classroom, yet no offense is taken when it is a straight comment. Again, I am not condoning this teacher's actions and I don't make any remarks about my gay students' sexuality or my straight ones for that matter. The question I'm asking is, when is it going to be ok for people to be gay?
     
  20. indigo-angel

    indigo-angel Companion

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    May 25, 2010

    Understood.
     
  21. msmullenjr

    msmullenjr Devotee

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    May 26, 2010

    I responded to what I see right here, like it or not. I don't really care.
     
  22. catnfiddle

    catnfiddle Moderator

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    May 26, 2010

    We're not talking about moves by the Department of Education to strip this teacher of her license. She may be a great fit at another school or in another year. In this particular school at this time, it seems like she is doing damage.
     
  23. indigo-angel

    indigo-angel Companion

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    May 26, 2010

    Which proves my point.:rolleyes:
     
  24. Soccer Dad

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    Jun 6, 2010

    Just got a text from a coworker---she's NOT COMING BACK NEXT YEAR!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
     
  25. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 6, 2010

    YAY!!!!

    But here's the $64,000 question-- is she leaving teaching or just your school??
     
  26. Soccer Dad

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    Jun 7, 2010

    Our district!!!!!
     
  27. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 7, 2010

    OH NO!!!!!! PLEASE tell me she's not headed for mine!!!!

    I've had it up to HERE with bad teachers this year!!!
     
  28. Soccer Dad

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    Jun 7, 2010

    Well, she made quite the impression today as she popped a movie on for her kids, walked down to the teacher's lounge for history/English and made herself lunch and ate, leaving the kids unattended. I should hope that that will be told to any future schools interviewing her.

    Alice, I've had it with the teachers that think that just because they have tenure they can do the bare minimum--even less in some cases!
     
  29. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 7, 2010

    Oh, so you've met Kira's teacher???
     
  30. Soccer Dad

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    Jun 7, 2010

    Thankfully I've only heard of her. Her name appeared on a list of lazy teachers along with about half my department....
     
  31. MsMar

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    Jun 7, 2010

    So glad to hear she will not be there next year.

    And Alice, I'm glad you already know Kira will have a good teacher next year. Just a few weeks left with this one :).
     
  32. CindyBlue

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    Jun 8, 2010

    Holy, cow, what did this teacher do? Aliceacc, you are very tolerent and very open to different teaching styles (I've read so many of your posts!) Your daughter's teacher must be a real winner...
    I can't imagine leaving a roomful of kids for any reason other than a medical emergency, much less to eat lunch! Obviously this person doesn't have a clue. Sheesh!
     
  33. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 8, 2010

    The very short version:

    There are 29 kids in the class. We were up at school one night looking at art projects, and Kira's stuff was at one of the 4 groupings of 7/8 desks.

    But she mentioned that her "real desk" was over there.... five or six feet away, next to the teacher's desk. (For the record, that night was the ONLY time I've ever had the classroom teacher not present at this particular event. She was in school that day, but the evening session was covered by the aides.)

    Kira was sitting all by herself, all day long, day after day, for at least several weeks. (THey "make plans" as to who to sit with at lunch during the morning, while they're sitting together. Well, at least the other 28 kids did. Kira made no plans for at least several days because she was across the room from her classmates, so she sat all by herself. Day after day. And nobody stopped her. Remember, she's SEVEN! sitting all by herself. Alone. All day long. For weeks. )

    Because she's a holy terror?? Nope. SHe's had her card changed once-- to Orange (in October) and has gotten smiley faces on every weekly folder since.

    Why???

    Because "she's distracted" by the mayhem in that classroom. Because that's what "she prefers." Because "that's where the aide can help her". (Not HER aide; the classroom aide.) Because "there are some strong personalities in that room."


    Because the teacher is a moron-- and trust me, that's the kindest thing I've called her in the past few weeks. (Well, aside from the more polite words I used with the principal as I was sobbing on the phone.)

    Who is the adult in that room, making decisions in the best interests of my daughter??? Most certainly not her "teacher!!!"

    But all is well for her-- she has tenure and seniority, the magic combination that will keep her employed for the next 30 or so years until she's ready to retire.

    I can only hope that she comes to the realization that teaching is NOT for her and decides on a career change-- tonight!!!!
     
  34. PCdiva

    PCdiva Connoisseur

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    Jun 8, 2010

    That stinks that Kira has such a terrible teacher this year :( At least there are only 13 more days! Did you make a request for next years teacher?
     
  35. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 8, 2010

    There's only ONE class in her grade. The Superitendent decreed that no class be smaller than 16, and there are 29 kids in the class right now. (Though rumor has it that 3 are jumping ship after this nightmare year and sending their kids to private schools. Kira needs speech and reading, so that option isn't open to us.)

    But as I was crying on the phone with the principal, she promised me that Kira's class will finally have a real teacher next year and the year after. She named both of them-- wonderful, dedicated professionals who have a real knack for teaching.

    I don't envy them. They have 2 years to catch up on. (The K teacher went out on maternity leave and extended it for the whole year, leaving a very VERY overwhelmed LTS in her first year of teaching.)
     
  36. PCdiva

    PCdiva Connoisseur

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    Jun 8, 2010

    Wow! Im so suprised to hear that there are 1st grade classes that large on Long Island! I think the max for the primary grades in my district is 24 according to the teachers contract.
     
  37. Soccer Dad

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    Jun 8, 2010

    Alice, I'm very, very sorry to hear that. I can somewhat relate... my son was in and out of fourth grade due to juvenile diabetes. His teacher never sent home work even though both my wife and I went up to the school (right around the corner from our house) daily to get the work. The teacher claimed he couldn't possibly get the same experience--which is true, but I didn't want to see my son fall so far behind. My wife is a math teacher and was able to teach him the math at home, but his teacher used to do a lot of listening activities and reading comprehension which was hard to do at home. The saddest thing, of course, was seeing him not be able to socialize with his friends. And it sounds like your daughter has some of the same troubles as my son did--he isn't a strong reader at all. We've tried private tutoring, but he still (now in 8th grade) has trouble sounding out words and spelling them. Due to this, he hates reading and looks to avoid it. His teacher once suggested leaving him back a year and when he returned to school, he had courage enough to raise his hand to read aloud and the teacher told him to put his hand down, they didn't have all day--we lost it. I've never had such a negative experience before and was shocked at how much this teacher looked to avoid helping my son. He always and still does very well in science and math, but since fourth grade, we cannot get him back into reading and blame his teacher for giving such negative comments to my son during his short stays in the classroom.

    It astounds me how many teachers lost touch with their jobs--for some, it was never there. But to avoid helping a student, especially in those developmental years, is such a terrible and sickening thing.

    I hope Kira has an amazing year next year!
     
  38. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Jun 8, 2010

    Thanks, Soccer Dad-- that's the plan.

    One of my neighbors is an unemployed reading teacher. When school ends, I'm going to see about her tutoring Kira over the summer.
     
  39. missg86

    missg86 Rookie

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    Jun 11, 2010

    Aliceacc-

    I don't want to take over the post, and I'm sure I don't have all the info, but I'm not sure why you're so upset about your daughter's seating placement. We all know that the term "strong personalities" is teacher codeword for "these kids are out of control". If your daughter is that self aware enough to know that she would rather be seated apart from them to get her work done without distractions, I think that's commendable.

    You also have to look at it from another side: If your daughter asked to sit by herself and the teacher said no, then she became distracted by the students around her (which I've seen happen to the best, most well behaved students)-- how would you feel if her work started to slip, or she wasn't completing in class assignments, or her card ended up being moved? You would have every right to be upset-- especially if you found out that she requested to sit apart and the teacher denied her the chance to remove herself from the situation.

    Again, I'm sure I don't know the whole story, and this might have just been the straw that broke the camel's back, but it was just confusing to me.
     
  40. futureteach21

    futureteach21 Habitué

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    Jun 11, 2010

    Missg- My interpretation of Alice's situation was this: Kira has no history of being a problem in the classroom. She never flips her card nor does her teacher give any hint that Kira has issues in the classroom. The other students are the problems. The other students have "strong personalities". So, Kira is the one separated so she can concentrate, but in the end, Kira is punished because she is left out from other social activities. This also isn't an isolated incident, its been going on for a very long time. Hopefully I got that right, Alice.
     

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