Paying for daycare

Discussion in 'General Education Archives' started by Grammy Teacher, Apr 10, 2006.

  1. Grammy Teacher

    Grammy Teacher Virtuoso

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    I have a question. What do people do when they are no longer eligible for help in paying for their daycare? I see this happen time and again with parents and what a shame. They get assistance for their daycare...sometimes paying nothing or as little as 50.00/week. Then the parents get a small raise and are suddenly not eligible for help anymore. They are strapped with mortgages, etc and not enough money to pay for their childcare so they can continue to work full time. Can someone please tell me, what are these parents to do?
     
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  3. Beth2004

    Beth2004 Maven

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    I wish I had the answer to what these parents are supposed to do, but I have also seen it happen time and time again. I've seen the agencies who provide the assistance lose funding and therefore have to cut back on the people they offer assistance to and people go without necessary childcare. I really wish I had the answer.
     
  4. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    I wonder if these parents couldn't give up some "extras" they have at home. Now, you may think I'm too cynical, but I've seen time and time again these same families have money for PS2, XBox....plus the games that go with them, as well as money for cigarettes and liquor, etc. Now, I'm not saying all, BUT, I've seen a lot of this in families who say they "can't afford" daycare, yet manage to buy all that extra stuff. I have no sympathy for them.
    Sorry, probably not what you wanted to hear, but I think it is the truth more often then not.
     
  5. Grammy Teacher

    Grammy Teacher Virtuoso

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    That's not what I am seeing in these families. They drive older vehicles and work their butts off daily to provide. Their houses are very modest and they don't go on vacations or anything outlandish.
    I'm not referring to the types who you are possibly thinking of...the low lifers who smoke, drink, are rather disgusting people in general. I am referring to the nice young families who are struggling...making barely 7.00/hour, trying to support their family.
     
  6. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    Ok, then I reteract my previous statement! LOL! I don't have the answers other then perhaps they would be better off if they could find shift work so one parent could be home with the child at all times and they wouldn't need day care.
     
  7. Play to Learn

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    Oh yeah, I see where you are coming from. I work for Headstart and I went on a home visit at the beginning of the year. The family had a HUGE big screen TV. I do not even have one! They had no kitchen table, no car to drive, no toys for the children that I could see. But they had a nice big screen TV and livingroom set. Sorry I just did not understand that. I believe they need to set their priorities, just like the rest of us. But, I do understand there are families who are struggling and doing what they can. Right now I am faced with the Daycare problem, it is so hard in the summer. The older school age children (not old enough to stay at home) are off. I can not afford childcare through the summer for three children on my pay from Headstart. My husband is a liquor store manager and does pretty good, but still it is like I am working just to pay daycare. That is why I am working on doing family childcare in my home. Where I can care for my three children, one of those being only 4 1/2 months old.
     
  8. Proud2BATeacher

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    My sister made $50 too much, so she could not qualify for assistance. If I were these families I will tell my boss to keep the raise, so I could continue to receive assistance. Unfortunately these families will remain being "the working poor".
     
  9. Grammy Teacher

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    But telling the boss to keep the raise isn't the answer either. They have to make their house payments somehow...and try to better themselves.
     
  10. JenPooh

    JenPooh Virtuoso

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    This is the first thing that ran through my mind as well. I know the types Grammy are speaking of though...the ones that actually are trying to better themselves and are good stable parents. However, I have seen too many of the ones Kinder is mentioning, and I think too many people try to screw the system and that makes me sick.
     
  11. JenPooh

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    Then they should rent and get on a rent assistance program that most states have, in my opinion. I know it's a great goal for people to be able to own their own home, but there are other things to worry about first than owning a house.
     
  12. Beth2004

    Beth2004 Maven

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    The sad part is, though, I've worked with many families where mom and dad both work in factories for minimum wage, live in housing projects, are on welfare to help pay for food, take public transportation or walk because they don't have a car and still have their voucher for daycare taken away because they work too many hours or whatever when actually they hardly make enough money to pay for the bills they have even with all of the assistance.

    I also have seen many who screw the system too and it is those people that make it more difficult for those who really need it to get the assistance.
     
  13. Play to Learn

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    Where I live in Florida there are alot of migrant workers. There are parents who both work in the fields, for very low pay. If they miss a days work because their child is sick they about lose their job. I have known women in their 7th month pregnacy working in the fields to get by. Alot will not ask for help. They are afraid of being sent back to Mexico. And the ones who do get help, it is just not enough. The homes they live in, every room has a bed in it. Very poor people. Children not in a school are usually kept by one family member who will have up to 20 kids at a time. I am not seeing this in one family I am seeing it in alot of the migrant workers families. They work so hard too. I have a child now who is 4, just missed the cut off for Kindergarten. His mother works two jobs, when he is not in school his 16 yr old brother takes care of him. Mom told me doing a parent teacher conference, they watch the 16 year olds movies all evening while she is working. This child is very delayed. I have put in referrals on him. He hardly eats. I know getting off the subject, What I am trying to say is, everyone struggles. Life just is not fair. I say be thankful for what you have and not what you dont have. Thats what I always tell my own children. There is always someone worse aff than you are.
     
  14. JenPooh

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    Very true!
     
  15. Grammy Teacher

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    If they don't qualify for child care assistance, they aren't going to qualify for rental assistance either. Smart young people know the value of investing in their own home while they are quite young so as to pay it off before they are very old. They do it for themselves and for their families...and that is the most important thing anyone could worry about...ever.
     
  16. Beth2004

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    That's not always true, though. As I said before, I've known many families who live in housing projects or section 8 housing (very cheap rent with the rest paid for by the state) but work too many hours a week or make just over the max amount and therefore get very little or no childcare assistance.
     
  17. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    I am just so thankful I was raised to respect the value of a dollar, not to buy on credit, and to tuck away a percentage of everything I earn. Except for our mortgage, my hubby and I are debt free (and we have saved enough to put our daughter through college without borrowing. I'm not saying that to be boastful, but just to say it can be done, even when you start out with nothing as we did. It just really takes discipline). We were both raised by fiscally responsible parents who taught us how to save...........even in the scarcest times for us......when we married in college(very low paying side jobs) and had our daughter, we still managed to stay off of welfare, save for our future, and live within our means. We never starved and our daughter never had to go without. It can be done, and I suggest more people should visit a financial planner so they learn how to live within their means, whatever it may be. The problem I see is that people don't know how to do that, nor do they know how to invest and save. I believe ANYONE can do it..........with the right tools and knowledge.
     
  18. Grammy Teacher

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    My husband and I make what we consider to be a decent living. We are also debt free, except for our mortgage. We have credit cards for emergency use...but we do not use them. However, if we had to pay 600.00 a month for child care(which is what it costs in this area...it is much more in cities,) we would NOT be able to do it.
    Kinder, I know there are people who do not manage their money well and may need some help, but the people I am seeing this happen to are hard working families who are caught in the middle. It has nothing to do with using their income wisely! They plain and simply do not make enough money!
     
  19. Grammy Teacher

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    Beth, so what are those people doing with their kids so that they can go to work? I am curious as to what you are seeing. You seem to understand their plight and I respect your opinion.
    I can give one example of a couple who had a child and were living apart. When they moved in together, they lost their child care help and could not afford to pay it and their housing. So, they had to move in with their parents and that was a disaster as you can imagine.
     
  20. kinderkids

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    I understand that...........I really do. I think the only answer in that case is that they need to get a second job. I really don't know what else they can do. If they aren't making enough with the job they have, then they must take on a second job for as long as it takes to get out of the hole and build some equity. Of course it isn't easy, but hard work and discipline with their money WILL get them ahead if they are patient. If it takes them working two jobs or more, then that is what it takes. I think of my dad and grandpa during the depression........they had nothing, worked eighteen hour days, and took any job that came along. To this day, my dad never complained about having to do that. He has one of the best work ethics of anyone I have ever seen. He didn't pity himself, pulled himself up by the boot straps, and worked his *** off! A great lesson for anyone is to study the depression era, we can learn a lot from those who lived through it.
     
  21. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    $600 a month for childcare- if you factor out about 10 days for weekends, you're paying $30 per day for what, 6-8 hours, maybe more? That's somewhere between $4-5 per hour. That's not a lot of money---children are expensive- diapers, formula, clothing, food, medical care, (these are just the absolute essentials....) It's something to consider when making the decision to parent...I work my teaching profession, tutor 3 kids, teach an afterschool enrichment program and a college graduate class. I don't live extravagantly and I still have money concerns.....one kid in college, one in high school and headed to college in 2 years, my husband and I both drive cars with over 100,000 miles on them each....plus a home mortgage etc etc.....No one said it was easy.
     
  22. Grammy Teacher

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    Getting a second job will take a parent away from the family too much. I know of families who do that. Their whole family is suffering because of their long hours away. The one parent is at home doing all the house chores and by the time the other parent gets home, the children are in bed. I think you are living in the past Kinder and really need to take a look at how things have changed. This is not the world it was during the depression. No one on this earth has had better work ethics than what is found in my family ... especially my mom and dad who also lived through the depression and hard times...This is not the same world...I feel so sorry for young people these days. If all you can think of are the losers who don't work and milk the system, then I guess we will never see eye to eye on this subject.
     
  23. Play to Learn

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    Can they get assistance for more training in their field of work. That may help them to get an even bigger raise or job. Maybe they can get a pell grant.
     
  24. Rosieo

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    I think what really frustrates me is when some families keep on having kids and can't afford them. Maybe not the ones that Grammy is talking about but the ones that keep having more and expect everyone else to pay their bills.
     
  25. kinderkids

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    I disagree, Grammy! We have it a lot better today then people did during the depression. I don't think I'm living in the past at all. If a parent needs to be away in order to support their family, then so be it. Sorry, but that is the harsh reality. Life is full of choices and decisions. But that is ok..........we can agree to disagree on this one.
     
  26. Grammy Teacher

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    czacza, this is not a discussion about whether people should have children or not. Nothing is going to stop that...nothing.
    Also, that $600.00 is just a low estimate...most places charge a lot more...
    Regardless of how you live or what you do, the bottom line is, there are people who do not make enough money to pay those prices. Some families have more than one child, so lets double that price ... or at least increase it...perhaps they have 3 children. Not have children? The children are already here...too late to say maybe they shouldn't have children.
     
  27. Grammy Teacher

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    Kinder, I thought you had more empathy for people who are trying hard and just can't make it. Guess I was wrong.
    Another thing to realize is that when a parent is gone from their family all of the time, marriages suffer. There is too much stress put on the mate...and the children. Besides, another minimum wage job is not going to make a big enough difference and the results are poor health from exhaustion.
     
  28. Rosieo

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    If someone falls on hard times that is one thing. Many companies are laying off people and these people need help to get them on their feet. But i see parents that continue to have more children when they can't afford the ones they have. That is not right. Every parent needs to take responsibility for their families. Yes, let's help the ones that fall on hard times but I do not support helping those who feel that they can continue to have children and they KNOW they can not afford them.
     
  29. GlendaLL

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    People need to think responsibly before they have their children. They need to consider all that is involved with having a child, including the financial responsibilities. That is exactly what my husband and I did when we were considering whether we wanted another child, after having our son. There were two factors that determined, for us, that we would only have one child - one was that we were "older" parents and the other was that we did not want to take on the financial burden of having another child.

    If you choose to take on the responsibility of having a child, you need to accept the responsibility of paying the bills for the child - medical, education, food, clothing, and daycare.
     
  30. Rosieo

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    I completely agree with you Glenda!
     
  31. Grammy Teacher

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    What you all seem to be missing is that the children are already here...too late! Now what?
     
  32. kinderkids

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    Grammy, just because I think someone should take a second job to pay the bills and take care of their family , that makes me lacking empathy? I am full of empathy and I'm thinking about the kids! Responsible parents do whatever they can to take care of their children. If that happens to mean they need to take on a second job to take care of them.............that is what they need to do. I don't think that makes me lack any empathy at all. If they are healthy and young, then by all means, there is absolutely no reason they can't take on another job if that is what is demanded of them to meet their families needs.
     
  33. Rosieo

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    Then those parents need to go and get the second job or work opposite shifts to make ends meet. It can be done. My husband and I did it when my kids were small for a while and yes it was not the best situation but we took responsibility for our family. It can be done. My kids are well adjusted even though for a short time my husband and I worked opposite shifts. As a matter of fact they are great kids and maybe we taught them a valuable lesson when that happened to us.
     
  34. Grammy Teacher

    Grammy Teacher Virtuoso

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    And if they are not healthy and strong?
     
  35. GlendaLL

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    Since the parents have chosen to have these children, they will have to do whatever is necessary in order to take care of them. That will probably mean that they will have to make sacrifices in their own personal lives - take on a second job or do without things for themselves.

    My husband and I chose to be responsible and only have one child. Because we made a responsible decision, we are financially comfortable and don't have to work second jobs or do without (too much.)
     
  36. Rosieo

    Rosieo Enthusiast

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    There will always be excpetions.
     
  37. kinderkids

    kinderkids Virtuoso

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    Then that is another story..........we have system of welfare to help those people get on their feet. But I would argue that a good majority of those we are talking about are healthy and strong and shouldn't be enabled by our welfare system.
     
  38. Rosieo

    Rosieo Enthusiast

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    Grammy I think that comment about Kinder was uncalled for. In many of kinders posts over the last several months she has shown nothing but empathy for children and adults in many situations.

    Marriages may suffer when a mate is gone but it can also make the relationship stronger when they work together for the same goal. I am living proof of that!
     
  39. Grammy Teacher

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    If you feel like it's harder to provide the kind of middle class upbringing for your kids that your parents gave you, you may be right.

    According to Elizabeth Warren and Amelia Warren Tyagi, coauthors of "The Two-Income Trap: Why Middle Class Mothers and Fathers Are Going Broke," the average two-income middle class family today earns 75 percent more than the typical single-income family did 30 years ago. But today's family, they say, ends up with less money for everyday living expenses and savings.

    Why? The costs of housing and a good education are killing them.


    In other words, the authors argue, it now takes two incomes to provide what one income provided 30 years ago: a middle class home in a safe neighborhood with a decent public school.

    And that doesn't even factor in the cost of a private school or, for that matter, college, which the authors argue is now viewed as a must-do for today's parents in a way that it wasn't 30 years ago. So, too, is paying for kids to go to a good pre-school.

    With faith in the public school system declining, Warren and Tyagi contend, bidding wars erupted for homes in what are thought to be good school districts, making homes in those areas ever more expensive.

    The authors also suggest that the rise in two-income families contributed to the rise in home prices, since two-income families could outbid families with only one breadwinner. As a result, now you often need two incomes to be able to buy a home in a middle class neighborhood.






    And here's the kicker: The two-income family appears to be in a more precarious position financially than yesteryear's one-income family. Warren and Tyagi calculate today's two-earner family is two-and-a-half times more likely to face a job loss than their counterpart of the early 1970s.

    Should one partner's paycheck be lost or reduced, their back is against the wall.

    Families can choose to reduce what they spend on food, clothing, savings, vacations or extracurriculars, "but you can't cut back a little on the mortgage or health insurance or tuition," said Warren, a Harvard law professor and bankruptcy specialist.

    The wealthy are costing you
    Here's another reason the cost of leaving it to Beaver may have become more prohibitive: The consumer behavior of the wealthy has upped the ante for everybody else.

    Then and now: Are price increases outpacing inflation?
    minimum wage Gallon of gas (in NY) Washington Post Television Yankees ticket Corvette Movie ticket Bob Dylan album Postage stamp Pair of Levi's jeans
    How much would: $
    in: 19131914191519161917191819191920192119221923192419251926192719281929193019311932193319341935193619371938193919401941194219431944194519461947194819491950195119521953195419551956195719581959196019611962196319641965196619671968196919701971197219731974197519761977197819791980198119821983198419851986198719881989199019911992199319941995199619971998199920002001 be worth today?



    Cornell Professor of Economics Robert H. Frank calls the phenomenon the "expenditure cascade." As he wrote, "When top earners build larger mansions ... they shift the frame of reference that defines an acceptable house for those just slightly below them on the income scale. And when those people respond by building bigger houses, they in turn shift the frame of reference for those just below them, and so on, all the way down."

    The median size of a newly built home in 1970 was 1,500 square feet, Frank notes. By 2000, it had increased to 2,300 square feet, even though the median family's income hasn't changed much.

    But aren't we better off in other ways?
    While it may be true that a great number of middle class families are more strained financially than their parents, some would argue there are a lot of ways our lives have improved relative to a generation ago.

    Safety standards are higher, health care has advanced, women now enjoy far greater career opportunities than at any time in history, and it's no longer considered unusual --
    Elizabeth Warren

    Everyday Money

    or Create your own

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    And there are some things that actually cost less than they did in your parents' day. Clothes, for instance. You now have a greater number of choices at lower costs thanks to discounters such as Targets or Marshall's, Warren and Tyagi note.

    But, according to the authors, that may be little comfort to the family who worries that paying for their daughter's Girl Scout outfit might compromise their ability to make the mortgage next month.

    Jeanne Sahadi writes about personal finance for CNN/Money. She also appears regularly on CNNfn's "Your Money," which airs weeknights at 5 p.m. ET. For comments on this column or suggestions for future ones, please e-mail her at everydaymoney@cnnmoney.com.
     
  40. Rosieo

    Rosieo Enthusiast

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    Ok time to move on to a new topic. Is everyone ready for the nicer weather???????????????????????:)
     
  41. ViolaSwamp

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    The only thing I can think of is for one parent to stop working. Honestly. If a person is working for $7 hour they are barely making enough to cover only the childcare for 2 children. Actually, are they even making enough? I don't know the cost of childcare. If one salary does not cover the childcare there is no justification. If the salary goes entirely to childcare it would be cheaper for that person to stay home. If a parent stays at home that parent can do a lot to save money. The family could probably survive on one car with the stay at home parent driving the worker to work (the kids can go in their jammies). They could shop the ads for sales on food and make home cooked meals. I think many don't realize that one fast food meal for a family of four can cost upwards of $10-20. I can buy a lot of groceries with that. Even convenience foods from the freezer section at the grocery store cost a lot when you add them up. Sometimes as much as fast food! Not to mention that they would have a lot lower income and might qualify for the assistance again. It's counterintuitive but it actually makes sense. Oh and in some states waiting tables pays pretty well. Put myself through college doing it. I worked 20-25 hours a week and made more than my cook boyfriend who worked 40 hours a week at $9-10 an hour.
     

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