Obama statement

Discussion in 'Debate & Marathon Threads Archive' started by czacza, May 1, 2011.

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  1. Cerek

    Cerek Aficionado

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    Osama was the main source of financing and organization for Al Qaeda. He was also the one that had the vision and planning to plot many of the attacks against the US during the 90's. Of course, others will step in to take over leadership and sentiment among the terrorists won't change, but this is a serious blow against their future efforts.
     
  2. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    "Dear Bin ladin .....I Win..... sincerely Waldo"
     
  3. webmistress

    webmistress Devotee

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    When it was first announced I jokingly told my husband (who is in the Navy) that I bet a Navy Seal did it. :woot: Funny I was right and I knew nothing about the military before meeting my husband. Navy seals also killed the Somalian pirates during that hostage situation.

    Navy Seals really really AMAZE me.
     
  4. Securis

    Securis Cohort

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    Dave, I completely empathize. I feel no less impacted. I have former students involved in the conflict as well. I know and have worked with dozens of adults and children from NYC. I even had friends in Israel who have been killed in bombings. I'm not belittling the effort. I'm not even belittling the outcome. I'm just asking myself the question, "What's this really mean?" in the larger scope of things and I arrive at the metaphor of a small piece of candy when I'm really hungry. Nothing has changed. Gladness is not something I associate with what is happening overall and so no part makes me glad. Concerned and even a bit disturbed but never glad.

    Hopefully but I highly doubt that. Ideologically, they'll paint him as a reason to increase their own furor. Thus, this man is now the definition of "martyr". That is a problem that's not going away any time soon.

    And.... A serious blow isn't a death blow and now we have to wonder who these new people/ financiers will be.
     
  5. MissCeliaB

    MissCeliaB Aficionado

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    I agree. I always have a hard time celebrating when a person, no matter how bad, loses their life. I feel the same way when convicted murderers are executed, and I felt the same way even when Saddam Hussein was executed. I feel a mix of relief, or sadness for the person's victims, sympathy for the person's family, anger that as an American citizen someone had to take another person's life in my name even though I do not agree with the action at all, and general dread for the future. Nowhere in that mix is joy or happiness. I was horrified to see the celebrations. It makes us look no better than when they show news of people in other countries dancing in the streets to celebrate the death of people. When that happens, we are horrified and talk about the inhumanity of these people. Truthfully we are no better, and I think it's time we stop acting like we are.

    I will celebrate when the Patriot Act is lifted and all the soldiers come home.
     
  6. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Hell just got a little more crowded.
     
  7. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Yes, he was on the doorman's list! He got to go in with no cover charge.
     
  8. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I do not like it when someone dies but as in the old west some were let off because the victim "Deserved kill'n " this is such a case.
    I have felt a wave of gladness over this since I spent much time worrying about my son who was in the gulf on a Navy ship during the fighting and My Daughter in law who was to be deployed to Afghanistan.

    I will celebrate his death because he was the epitome of evil.
    He is now sharing a cell in hell with Hitler.
     
  9. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    I agree - I always felt like we gave Osama a little too much credit - he was just one guy. Glad they found him, not saying we should have gone after him, but what does all this mean now? I doubt anything is "over." I'll be glad when our troops are back on American soil. That will make me dance in the streets.
     
  10. MissCeliaB

    MissCeliaB Aficionado

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    I'm disappointed that the US buried him at sea. I would have hoped they would have notified his family and given them the opportunity to bury him under Muslim requirements, or at least see the body. I'm glad to see that the US did bury him according to those customs. To not do so could make things much worst or at best have people talking about a lack of cultural sensitivity.
     
  11. KinderCowgirl

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    I didn't see the actual speech, but even if it was all "I"'s don't you think he does deserve some of the credit. I know military campaigns are planned by a lot of people, but he is certainly at the top.

    My fear is also retaliation. Certainly that we got him is great news, but I hope people don't think this will be the end.
     
  12. JustMe

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    I'm glad someone else had the nerve to share that even the loss of life such as his can leave room for some less than celebratory feelings. So many American people are praising God for his death, yet everything Osama did he did for God...

    I'm unsure of how I feel about the death penalty in general, though as my views of the afterlife have changed I am more open to it, but overall I feel this man's death was plenty justified. It just reminds me of Lennon's "Imagine"...
     
  13. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I did a word search and he only used "I" about 12 times and "we" over 35

    It has been reported that he has already been buried at sea in accordance to Muslim "law."
     
  14. MissCeliaB

    MissCeliaB Aficionado

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    I was just logging on to post this. Many of the times he used "I" it was in regard to his role as Commander in Chief. For example, "I was briefed," "I met repeatedly with my national security team," "I called President Zarardi." Those are things that a US President does, and in telling the story of how this all happened, important details. Why should he minimize his role as the head of the US military? Why would he say that someone else made the calls if he was the one who ultimately made the calls? I'm glad he took responsibility/credit for it.

    I loved almost all of his speech, and may use it as an example in my speech courses. Like him or not, it is hard to deny that Obama is an excellent orator.
     
  15. silverspoon65

    silverspoon65 Enthusiast

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    I worked with someone who was Muslim and had lung cancer. When he passed away the funeral was the next day. I believe it is common practice to bury the body within 24 hours.

    I might be wrong, but I think the water burial was to deter either side from disturbing the body.
     
  16. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    I feel it is just like 9/11, it happened during Bush's watch and this happened during Obama's watch. Credit should go to the service men and women doing "the work in the trenches"

    I did the word search because I didn't think he over did the "I" in his announcement
     
  17. stephenpe

    stephenpe Connoisseur

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    I liked that he called Bush first. Bush made good comments, also.
    Some wingnuts posted that Obama "bombed" children in
    Libya. Bet they don't say he "killed" Osama.
    Who would have guessed a socialist Muslim born in Kenya would
    kill Bin Laden. ;)

    Mission Accomplished.
     
  18. Sarge

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  19. Kindergarten31

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    I know this is a hot button topic, but I agree with MissCeliaB. I am glad this horrible person is dead, but I was upset when I watched the dancing and celebrating. I, too, knew people who lost their lives in the service and right now my granddaughter is overseas in the Navy(location unknown) and grandson in the Army. But it just troubled me.
     
  20. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    AND ON MAY DAY ;)
     
  21. Major

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    From the Godfather........


    Sonny: "What the hell is this?
    Tessio: "It's a Sicilian message. It means Luca Brasi sleeps with the fishes."

    More currently.........

    U.S. Navy Seals: "It's a U.S. military message. It means that murderer, Bin Laden, sleeps with the fishes."
     
  22. Cerek

    Cerek Aficionado

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    Burial at sea also prevents the exact location from being known and becoming a focal point for those his followers. It should help reduce his effectiveness as a martyr, although it certainly won't eliminate it.

    From what I've read, burial at sea does comply with Muslim law, as does burial within 24 hours. I am glad our military respected the customs of Muslim law, despite the heinous nature of the man himself. :thumb:
     
  23. SandyCastles

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    I am in Abu Dhabi now and they are reporting a little bit of a different perspective on the news here. Depending on the channel that is on, they are either showing the scenes in NYC and D.C. and the relief that America is feeling. That is CNN. BBC is reporting more along the lines from Pakistan and Afghanistan, showing how it actually happened and that the European Union is also happy. They give a little more history behind bin Laden and al Qaeda. They show some of the locals in Pakistan and Afghanistan and how they are also glad. No one knew that he was living in the city. Al Jazeera (which is also broadcast in English) is pretty much the same as BBC. It is being reported that the Pakistani president did not know ahead of time that we were going to go in and do this final attack. It said he wishes he did know. I saw him giving a statement. They have also said that the people in the countries over here want the U.S. to either withdraw or stick to the time frame for withdrawal of the troops now that he is dead.

    They have sent out a worldwide travel alert warning Americans living and traveling abroad to be alert and to stay in their home or hotel as much as possible and avoid demonstrations. I think it will be safe for the most part in my country because most people came here to get away from the terror. But only time will tell.

    It is Muslim tradition to bury the body within 24 hours. The news about this broke when I was on my way to school this morning... about 6:30 a.m. our time on May 2nd. I think Pakistan is an hour ahead of us.
     
  24. scienceteach82

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    Our news station said Hitler's death was also announced on 5-1.


    I am glad he's dead...but I would have rather seen him caught alive and faced everyone.
     
  25. scmom

    scmom Enthusiast

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    We can agree to disagree. When I listened it just hit me wrong. I think it would have been a much more powerful message if the first part had not centered around the "I" decided, briefed, called or whatever else he said. We didn't need to know the obvious. It just felt to me like he needed us to give him credit for doing his job. I think the center of attention should have been the thousands of brave men and women who have been trying to follow through on his orders, not the one who gave the order. Also, what took him so long? If he knew about it in advance, why didn't he have his speech prepared?
     
  26. Ranchwife

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    I so completely agree. Where he said, "I", he should have been saying "we." Arrogant. Other than that one paragraph, his speech was pretty good.

    I'm just glad Bin Laden is gone.
     
  27. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    God Bless the U.S. Navy Seals........ They are a hard core, skilled, brave group of warriors..... :thumb::thumb:
     
  28. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    "Arrogant" isn't a word I'd ever use to describe President Obama.

    In his speech where he used "I" statements, it was generally to describe his actions within a timeline of events. He has typically given speeches like this, where he describes how everything unfolded. There are things that he, as commander-in-chief, did that no one else did, so it wouldn't be appropriate for him to use "we" statements all the time.

    Below are ALL the "I" statements that President Obama used in his speech. I think that in every one of them you'll see that he is either describing his role in the events as they unfolded (and those sorts of descriptions are best made with "I" statements) and/or decisions that he made as commander-in-chief (and those sorts of decisions are made by no one else). I guess if you want to be critical of him, fine, but I don't think it's appropriate to criticize him for saying "I" too many times. He used an "I" statement exactly 7 times. He used a "we" statement 37 times.


    "Tonight, I can report to the American people and to the world that the United States has conducted an operation that killed Osama bin Laden, the leader of al Qaeda, and a terrorist who’s responsible for the murder of thousands of innocent men, women, and children."

    "And so shortly after taking office, I directed Leon Panetta, the director of the CIA, to make the killing or capture of bin Laden the top priority of our war against al Qaeda, even as we continued our broader efforts to disrupt, dismantle, and defeat his network."

    "Then, last August, after years of painstaking work by our intelligence community, I was briefed on a possible lead to bin Laden."

    "I met repeatedly with my national security team as we developed more information about the possibility that we had located bin Laden hiding within a compound deep inside of Pakistan."

    "And finally, last week, I determined that we had enough intelligence to take action, and authorized an operation to get Osama bin Laden and bring him to justice."

    "Tonight, I called President Zardari, and my team has also spoken with their Pakistani counterparts."

    "And tonight, let us think back to the sense of unity that prevailed on 9/11. I know that it has, at times, frayed. Yet today’s achievement is a testament to the greatness of our country and the determination of the American people."
     
  29. MuggleBug

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    Facebook status I saw: "Obama birth certificate and Osama death certificate in the same week??"

    [​IMG]
     
  30. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    :lol:

    They buried him at sea for a couple of reasons: 1) so his grave would not become a shrine and 2)no country would take his remains (so the news reported). They did bury him according to Muslim law (and that's nicer than what I think he deserves).

    [/QUOTE]

    The news here reported that the Navy Seals went into his mansion in Pakistan (that happened to be near a Pakistan military base). He actually fought back and was shot in the head. This took place a week ago; however, they wanted to make sure that it was actually him so completed DNA testing to ensure it was him.
     
  31. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    * If we want this thread to stay open let us try harder to not make it political and have emotions rise to a level that has caused past threads closed
     
  32. mrachelle87

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    I think we have moved away from the original thread...with that said, I cried last night when I heard the news. My baby cousin has been in Afgahnastan for going on 18 months. He has a small child (just turned 4 last month) that he has only seen for less than 6 months at a time (twice) since she was born because he has been deployed to Afgahnastan. All I can think about is that is the sacrifice our family and especially his baby, have made for our country. Now I am praying that in 6 weeks he comes home safely. Our brave soldiers have been fighting this demon and his troops for too long, but I am not stupid enough to think that this is the end of it.
     
  33. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    I wonder if this was the last thing bin Laden saw ........ Navy Seals are awesome...:thumb:.. I like the statement about "when" the SEALS have to use a back up handgun.....

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KTVBYlHsIRY
     
  34. kcjo13

    kcjo13 Phenom

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    I had a difficult conversation with my 5-year old this morning. My 10-year old and I were discussing what happened, and the younger one overheard. Of course, she wanted to know what we were talking about.

    Me: We're talking about a very bad man who had killed a lot of people and tried to hurt a lot of innocent people around the world.

    Her: So what happened to him?

    Me: Well, we killed him.

    Her: I thought it was bad to kill people?

    Me: Well, it is. He killed a lot of people.

    Her: Then why did he get the same thing?

    I didn't really have an answer to that.

    Make no mistake, I'm glad he's incapable of harming or causing others to harm innocent people. But sometimes it takes a 5-year old to bring you back to the reality and gravity of the situation.
     
  35. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Yes, indeed, kcjo.
     
  36. EdEd

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    It's been really cool seeing different people on different forums (facebook, text, twitter, here, etc.) really reflect on this situation - what it means to rejoice over death, why finding him has been so important, etc. It's been cool to see the nation reflect, rather than just rejoice.

    My only comment is that it has been unfortunate to see some politicize the situation - seeing the event as a means of political gain for Obama. Ironically, those who make statements such as, "Obama is trying to politically take advantage of the situation" are the ones themselves who are attempting to take political advantage of the situation by politicizing it. He may try to capitalize at some point, but the folks attempting to label his speech last night as political are likely the ones so wrapped up in political propaganda that they can't emerge from their camps long enough for 5 minutes of national unity. If we are to come together as a country, we should start addressing the content of what people say, not our assumptions about people's underlying agenda's that have no basis in anything but paranoid skepticism.

    At the same time, I guess politics in this country (and others) has become so much about hidden agendas that our citizens can't even accept that a speech may not be valid on it's face - this may reflect more about our political system itself, rather than on those who consume it.
     
  37. JustMe

    JustMe Virtuoso

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    CNN reported it took longer than anticipated to contact all those who he wanted to share the news with first. If someone is complaining about a delay for something this serious, it seems their personal opinions are coloring their take on this whole event in a major way, and I will also have to agree to disagree.
     
  38. Jem

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    Exactly. Obama is the current president of the United States. I would expect nothing less than for him to give a speech talking about how he and the military found Osama. That's what presidents do-they update the public on major world events, many of which they are a part of. I'm not sure what else would have been expected-should he have walked out with a Republican by his side just to make sure it was an un-bias statement? It was a statement by our Commander in Chief about a military operation. Our Commander in Chief happens to be a democrat. That does not mean that the democrats masterminded the capture and will now campaign on it. It is what it is.
     
  39. Joyful!

    Joyful! Habitué

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    What comes to mind is a verse in the book of Romans, "Rejoice with them that do rejoice and weep with those who weep." For me, I rejoice with every American who finds closure and relief and even joy to find the one credited with so much destruction and death of their loved one has been eliminated. I am also sad any time someone dies, particularly the person who became a human shield. In my heart, I know I am not a warrior. I know very few teachers who have a warrior's heart. As a teacher, I tend to worry over the one who gets expelled from school, but know it had to be for the greater good of those in the school I tend to look at OBL's death in the same light. I don't pretend to know what it takes to be a warrior. However, I have the greatest respect and admiration for those who could set aside their own personal feelings about life and the ending thereof for the purpose of the greater mission that was set at their hand. I am grateful that the military does for me what I could not do for myself. I am happy for Presidents Bush and Obama knowing that the burdens they faced because of this man are in a small way lessened. I pray for God to bless Obama in leading the nation. I think this is a time when we can ALL be grateful for the bravery of the SEALS and that they only lost a copter. May God keep all of our troops safe each moment they are in harm's way.
     
  40. Major

    Major Connoisseur

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    Let's not forget that this bastard was the leader of a heinous plot to slaughter thousands innocent Americans. I can only imagine what it was like to be an innocent passenger in one of those doomed planes. I still vividly see the planes crashing into the towers. I can still vividly see people choosing to jump to their deaths rather than burn to death inside the burning towers. I still see the towers crumbling.

    This jihadist deserved a much worst fate than a bullet in the head....
     
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