# Not giving zeroes

Discussion in 'General Education' started by Ms.Holyoke, Sep 8, 2018.

1. ### mathmagicEnthusiast

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Sep 8, 2018

This would worry me. I'd prefer admin to not be purposefully ballooning the scores, but rather trying to assess why student scores are so low, and addressing the underlying issue causing that.

2. ### a2zMaven

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Sep 8, 2018

How is this any different than giving a 60 as the lowest grade?

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Because it's giving a 0 as the lowest grade. Again, it's not a scale I actually use, but if push came to shove, I would condense the currently wide "F" range this way instead.

4. ### mathmagicEnthusiast

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Mathematically, your conversions effectively create the '0' as a '60' in their respective grading scales. If you're meaning just the shock-element of the student getting a '0', then yes, that would allow for that. However, as a2z said, there's no effect on the scoring system otherwise.

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Sure, but it's a nicer packaging that allows you to give out 0s still without them being as devastating by condensing the "F" range in the way the other ranges are condensed.

6. ### mathmagicEnthusiast

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Could you explain what you mean by "devastating"? As I read it, I'm hearing a connotation that denotes that the a 0 (in 0-4) vs. 60 (in 60-100) leads to a different overall grade/result. However, it doesn't. That's the confusion a2z and I are having. Condensing the F range and utilizing the 0-4 range in the way you're describing is no different, with the exception of the latter being extra work, at least from what I can see.

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Sep 8, 2018

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The difference EXCLUSIVELY is that you can say....you don't do your homework, that's a zero!!!!!

Listen I give 0s so it was a hypothetical different way to package it. I'm not married to because I don't use it so we don't have to get our panties in a bunch over the wrapping paper.

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9. ### mathmagicEnthusiast

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Well, first, I don't wear that kind of underwear being a guy , and don't worry, I'm not!

I was simply curious if there was something I was missing. That's what I was wondering about: if your idea behind it was solely around the shock value of the zero, vs. there being an actual mathematical difference. Thank you for clarifying that!

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10. ### 2ndTimeAroundPhenom

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Sep 8, 2018

I LIKE the shock value of a zero. Kids in high school NEED to know that they get nothing if they give nothing.
I don't have any problem with giving second chances. Allowing a child another day to submit work. But giving grades for work not done isn't my style.

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Sep 8, 2018

This. Exactly this!

12. ### vickilynMagnifico

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Sep 8, 2018

I think that having this discussion about fifth graders is a little different than having the same discussion about high school students. Just a personal opinion.

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Why is it that special considerations need to constantly be made for elementary students all of a sudden? Students did just fine with traditional grading and grade weights in the late 1990’s and early 2000’s. How are they going to cope when they get to middle school and high school?

14. ### MathGuy31Rookie

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Sep 8, 2018

I believe that zero's should be given under the right circumstances . As well as other disciplinary actions that correlate with the school. Staying in at recess, detention, and other things. But yes, zero's should be given if the student is just plainly not doing work for no logical reason. Parents/counselors should be intervened as well if this is a regular occurrence.

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15. ### vickilynMagnifico

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Sep 9, 2018

Primarily I was concerned by the amount of weight that classwork is given in OP's 5th grade class - 55%. I teach HS, and classwork typically counts for no more that 20%, sometimes even 15%. Tests, quizzes, and projects make up the bulk of the grade - 80%-85%. Personally, I would find a better way to make some of that classwork grade a true assessment grade, which would allow her to restructure her percentages to something more like HS, but if she maintains that classwork will be the majority of the grade I would hesitate to give a zero for work done incorrectly. They can fail to get the assignment correct, earning an F, which is still a 65, not a zero, but a zero should be reserved for someone who sat through the entire period without even trying to do the work. If the kid who does nothing gets the same zero as the kid who tried, but didn't master the assignment (did it incorrectly), how long do you think it will take for the kid who used to try to just do nothing, too? All of this is just my opinion, of course, but I see a major difference between wrong answers with work versus absolutely no attempt to do the work.

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16. ### Ms.HolyokeConnoisseur

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Sep 9, 2018

I teach 6th grade but I agree that 6th grade is very different from high school.

For classwork, I will be grading some of it on mastery depending on the assignments. Kids will get some completion grades, but will also get grades for exit tickets and other classwork assignments based on mastery.