My 9 mo. old. falling out of her child bed

Discussion in 'Montessori' started by gillywilly, Jun 5, 2008.

  1. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    Now that my daughter is rolling freely, she has been rolling herself out of bed (mostly at nap time). What are some strategies to remedy this? Shes not hurting herself, mainly shes just working at nap time. Occasionally she gets herself in a precarious position, then cries to be helped. What can I do?
     
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  3. jw13

    jw13 Groupie

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    Is your 9mth old in a crib or bed?
     
  4. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    a bed. Its a 2/4' futon mattress. no frame.
     
  5. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    probably 4-5" between her and the floor (the width of the mattress)
     
  6. jw13

    jw13 Groupie

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    I don't know your circumstances, but it's not recommend for childrend under 3ft. tall to sleep outside of a crib. There are too many dangers to a child that age and size. They are unable to get themselves out of dangerous sleep situations. I would rethink your sleeping arrangements for the safety of you child.
     
  7. TeacherShelly

    TeacherShelly Aficionado

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    Well, don't push the mattress up against the wall, and don't use a bed rail. It's better she falls off the mattress than gets stuck and suffocates against the wall or against the bed rail. Crib mattresses are different than futon mattresses, so it's just not safe. Also, try not to use blankets or pillows if she's rolling around a lot. Get blanket sleepers or, better, the Halo Sleepsack. If you can, put her in one of the baby beds that go on top of your bed (or futon mattress).

    Look here, here, and here.
     
  8. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    This is the montessori forum, right?

    I mean, am I the only one here who uses a child bed at home?
     
  9. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    A bed for a 9 month old?!? My DD didn't have her own bed until she was 3. I agree with jw13 on this one. There are too many precarious situations that your child could get herself into.

    Montessori or not, it should be about the safety of your child.
     
  10. lemonhead

    lemonhead Aficionado

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    I am sorry. I didn't not read the age of your child. I retract my bed rail statement.

    I don't think this is a safe situation either. What do you do when she starts crawling around in the middle of the night?
     
  11. jw13

    jw13 Groupie

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    Yes, this is the montessori forum. However, we are talking about the safety of a child. Also, I don't believe a futon is a child bed or a child-safe bed. I stand by my statements.
     
  12. Tolentine Grad

    Tolentine Grad Rookie

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    I agree with the others. I have three little ones and my youngest is nearly 2yo and is still in a crib. It is the safest place, that is until they start to climb out. :)

    Nine months is entirely too young for a bed, especially a futon.
     
  13. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    I need not tell you what a great person Dr. Montessori was. The question is this: Are you willing to accept her teaching? Or do you choose from her teaching only those items that have a special appeal to you but disregard tenets which may be central to her approach?

    The Childbed is tantamount to the infant environment. It fosters independence from a childs earliest days.

    In The Secret of Childhood Montessori’s notion about sleep and the child is just beautiful, She describes cribs and playpens as prisons with bars. She suggests that a bed for the child should just be a little off the floor so that the preschool child can climb into it when tired and out of it when rested.

    I have seen it in action in the Montessori nursery I observed. Its a magical thing. A child is dreary, crawls to their bed, and climbs in. Upon waking, they crawl out and begin work.

    Obviously, the room must be treated as a 'crib' in and of itself. Completely free of hazard.

    I will continue to raise my child in true montessori form.
     
  14. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    have you read any of MMs texts? Im surprised that you all seem so shocked by my practice.
     
  15. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    Your title of the thread is that your child is FALLING out of her bed. How far up is the futon? I'm sure Dr. Montessori wasn't referring to futon beds as a "childbed". The futons that I have seen are dangerous beds for babies. I would hate for something serious to happen to your daughter because you're raising her in what you believe to be "true montessori form".
     
  16. jw13

    jw13 Groupie

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    I agree with, stg.
     
  17. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    This is taken from http://www.boyd.k12.ky.us/eclc/MONTESSORI EDUCATION.htm.

    Your child, if you are using a childbed, should not be falling out of the bed. The bed should be where she can easily get in and out of it.
     
  18. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I think the bed is realy a futon mattress on the floor STG. :)

    I guess I'm not into the Montessori philosophy. A little to out there for me. When I have a baby it will be in a crib.
     
  19. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    Im clearly in the wrong place for educated montessorian advice. Cant you people read? There is no danger. She is 4 INCHES from the floor. zomgz.
     
  20. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Gilly,
    When people push the view all new threads button all posts come up. I didn't realize this was in the Montessori forum. Sorry about that. Best of luck with everything.

    I think your baby is going to continue rolling out of the bed until she is old enough to realize in her sleep what she is doing. Than she will probably crawl right back into bed if she rolls out.
    Best of luck.
     
  21. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    Please don't get defensive. I agree with Jaime that some fo the Montessori philosophy is a little out there for me. And 4 inches off the ground isn't that far, but when you title your thread "falling" out of her bed, what kind of responses did you think you were going to get?
     
  22. lemonhead

    lemonhead Aficionado

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    I didn't realize this was montessori either. If a montessori baby cries for help because they are in a precarious position and need help, can't you just help them?
     
  23. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    I thought i was going to get responses from persons who have raised their children through the montessori philosophy. Not a bunch of dooms-dayers telling me that an age old practice is 'dangerous'.

    Thanks Jaime, the idea behind it is that children are able to do much more than most people give them credit for. They are able to decide when they are sleepy, that they want to go to bed, and vice versa. The result is a child (and adult later) who has experience and confidence in making decisions. (of course this only works when the adult has prepared the environment to not only be safe and comfortable, but stimulating and age appropriate.Thanks again.
     
  24. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    I agree that children need to be able to make choices, and the idea behind the childbed is a good one (just not one that I would incorporate for a 9 mo). However, and this is the last time I'm going to post here, the title of the thread lead many to believe that she was literally falling out of the bed. If she's only 4 inches off the ground, then like Jaime said, she'll remedy this situation on her own once she figures out what she's doing.
     
  25. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    are you serious? Did you even read the thread?

    No. Id much rather just let her lay there and cry. ;)


    Of course, that is what I do now. Im looking for strategies to AVOID such a situation.

    Im in the wrong place. carry on.
     
  26. lemonhead

    lemonhead Aficionado

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    gosh.

    I am not sure who the montessori people are on this site but maybe if you search the forums you will see some names and send them a private message and hope for an answer that will be the one you are looking for.
     
  27. smalltowngal

    smalltowngal Multitudinous

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    Try PMing mommieruthie. I know she teaches in a Montessori school.
     
  28. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I think it is mostly teachers on this site. I'm interested to know how you have the room set up. Is the mattress in the middle. What makes her cry out? Why does she need help sometimes? Is there a way to change your room around to make it so she doesn't end up in these situations?

    Of course we have come full circle back to your original question. I guess I'm not much help. Just can't picture the room in my head.
     
  29. jwilliamson

    jwilliamson Companion

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    Correct me if I am wrong, but you seem to be contradicting yourself. Here is your first past:

    "Now that my daughter is rolling freely, she has been rolling herself out of bed (mostly at nap time). What are some strategies to remedy this? Shes not hurting herself, mainly shes just working at nap time. Occasionally she gets herself in a precarious position, then cries to be helped. What can I do?"

    You say that she gets herself in a precarious situation and then cries to be helped. The Westers dictionary gives the meaning of precarious as this - characterized by a lack of security or stability that threatens with danger.

    Then you post this:

    "Im clearly in the wrong place for educated montessorian advice. Cant you people read? There is no danger. She is 4 INCHES from the floor."

    Is there danger or isn't there? If there is not, then why is she crying for help?

    Just trying to understand where you are coming from.
     
  30. gillywilly

    gillywilly Rookie

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    Jaime,
    lemmie see if i can get my camera working, Id love to up some pics so you can see the set up.
     
  31. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    Thanks Gilly.
     
  32. teach_each1

    teach_each1 Comrade

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    Can she walk/crawl or only roll? I would think that until she can walk or crawl you'll just have to roll her back up on her mattress. If she has more mobility then I would just let her figure it out.
     
  33. Redd3415

    Redd3415 New Member

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    I know there hasn't been any activity on this thread in a few days, but I thought I'd put my two pennies in. My daughter started sleeping on a futon mattress when she was about your child's age; maybe a little older, perhaps as much as a year old. She moves around a lot in her sleep (try sleeping in the same bed with her now lol) so we placed the mattress in a corner of the room and then padded the wall sides with body pillows and put a nice thick carpet on the floor by her bedside. She rolled out occasionally, but usually the only way we found out was by finding her asleep on the carpet in the morning. After a few times, she figured out to stay in the bed on her own. I know that you are not supposed to put a child's bed up against the wall or put pillows nearby to smother themselves with. I suppose some would say we were lucky she didn't. It seemed more natural and she slept better.
     
  34. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Well, I can honestly say, I may not be here long, because I pretty much overall agree with the majority. Infants should be in a crib. Toddlers, once able to climb, are the ones that you move to a bed. And then it is still a child-sized bed, with some type of support, like a frame, if they are prone to falling.

    Your title is clearly about your child falling out of her bed. I don't think you should be offended by anybody's response, because naturally...that's what people will say - put the child someone safe.

    But from an early childhood perspective, I will say this...

    I have observed Montessori and Reggio Emilla appropach. I pretty much don't care for either one. I think that there are many problems when children have too many choices, so I have too many issues with child centered, child driven programs.

    What I will say, is that I worked in a child care center, and the entire infant classroom had mats on the floor. Threre were NO cots or cribs. Their philosophy was that the child could fall under extreme circumstances, and the crib prohibits the child from using their gross motor skills. Therefore, they had each child on a mat, 18 inches apart from the other, and as they slept, they would roll over, and when they woke up, they simply got on all fours, and crawled over to the group, and joined the teachers. They didn't even sit and cry, because they could see us, and they would just crawl past their sleeping friends, and come out to the large room.

    Maybe this is what you are referring to. Please understand that although this is a Montessori forum, I am sure most of the threads center around preschool programs. I could be wrong, but continue to search for the answers you want.
     
  35. Redd3415

    Redd3415 New Member

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    Not to nit-pick, but if you don't like Montessori, why are you in a Montessori-themed thread? Certainly, it's not for everyone and I am not trying to convince you one way or another. Just struck me as odd.

    And please don't confuse "follow the child" with "do whatever the child wants." This is a whole other conversation/thread, but just to clarify, there is a large difference between those two statements.

    This is exactly what we are referring to. The freedom to get up and begin working/playing is very important and fosters independence in a big way for an infant. The fact that they don't have to rely on outside help to accomplish what they want is a big deal.

    :cool:
     
  36. Amanda

    Amanda Administrator Staff Member

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    I'm sorry this thread took this direction. :( I am familiar with the child bed and know that it isn't dangerous. Unfortunately there are not very many Montessori teachers here to give you advice on this. I would recommend the discussion forums at Mothering. I'm sure you'll find a lot of advice there since it is focused on parenting and topics like this! http://www.mothering.com/discussions/

    That said, I have a friend who used a futon on the floor next to her bed starting around 9 mo and I don't think they had this problem. My daughter sleeps on a twin mattress on the floor, but she started at 17 mo. I will probably start the next child sooner. We have a bed rail on one side and she crawls off and on at the end of the bed.

    Just so everyone else knows, it's about making the environment safe for the child, not keeping the child safe from the environment. You ensure the room is safe first and foremost. A crib is not necessary for many families. I realize many people haven't heard about this, but it isn't really fair to the poster to comment if you don't know anything about it. She wasn't looking to debate the safety (as she already knows it is safe). She was looking for advice from people who knew about Montessori, since this IS a Montessori forum. It's not a place for debating about whether you agree with the philosophy. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.
     
  37. trayums

    trayums Enthusiast

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    Practice or no practice, you are not being safe with a 9 month old baby... Sounds like you are trying to get a rise out of people... Very mature.
     
  38. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Thank you Amanda, for your continued guidance and support.

    As professionals, I believe we all strive to become lifelong learners, and for that reason, many of us visit several threads and post comments. I think it helps us all develop a clearer understanding of what our own philosophies are, and how we can work with others who may share opposing views.

    I agree that debating should take place in threads that are open to debate, and not those who are looking for answers. I believe that being on one side of the fence versus the other should not be a prequisite for posting a response.

    Reopening the thread allows the OP a chance to receive the guidance and support she is seeking. I gave my opinion and advice, which is what she wanted.
     
  39. Amanda

    Amanda Administrator Staff Member

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    I'd like to reiterate that the Montessori forum is not the place for debating Montessori philosophy. Thank you for your understanding and cooperation.
     
  40. Amanda

    Amanda Administrator Staff Member

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    My point is that those most who are responding don't even understand what the OP is talking about. It is not helpful at all. If you don't know about the Montessori philosophy and can't even picture a 9 month old on a futon mattress on the floor, your advice is not likely going to be helpful.
     
  41. trayums

    trayums Enthusiast

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    That is precisely why I apologized. I feel badly that I didn't read the entire post before I responded. Please feel free to delete what I wrote. I certainly didn't mean to be disrespectful in anyway.
     

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