Meeting with Education Department Chair

Also, I want to know this out of curiosity... Who do you believe God's mother is from a philosophical standpoint?

 

Yes, I honestly believe you are so far off base here it's scary.

 

I knew you would comment on that expression. :lol:

 

It's the same thing with religion. Religious parents typically threaten to beat or severely punish their child for not believing their religion, the same way as they would if they refused to say the pledge.

 

I honestly want to know what is wrong with a first day of school speech saying that it is within their rights to not say the pledge, and no teasing or harassing will be tolerated at anyone who isn't participating.

That is not telling that they can't or shouldn't say it. That is telling them that it is their right to not say it.

 

I think that's* fine. It's approximately EVERYTHING ELSE you've written in this thread that I find either confusing, disturbing, or laughable.

*Statement, though...no speech necessary.

 

You have the right to do a lot of things that you probably shouldn't do. You have the right to drive through an urban neighborhood, shouting racial slurs out your car door, but you shouldn't be surprised if it turns out badly for you.

To quote The Big Bang Theory, it's a "non-optional social convention." You have the right to refuse to say the pledge. You even have the right to tell everybody you meet that you have the right. But... you probably shouldn't. You just shouldn't. Even if you're fully within your rights to do so, it WILL put a target on you by both parents and administrators, and god forbid you have any parents that are vets.

 

At that age that right belongs to the parent. I personally don't say the pledge much my self. I think it is a mindless repeating of words without any heartfelt thought into what they mean or stand for...similar to the rosary in my religion.

However, I would never tell a child that they did not have to do it, I would direct them to their parents.

 

I'm Catholic. My boyfriend is Catholic. Both of our extended families are also Catholic. Nearly all of us went through a rebellious I don't believe stage. None of us were threatened or severely punished in any way. I find this comment beyond ridiculous. I'd love to see you interact with religious parents.

You don't have any sort of duty to cover the pledge. You teach math. Social studies teachers can inform students of their rights through lessons. Your speech is a bad idea. If and when students are making fun of another student (or you) for not saying the pledge, then give your speech. Until then you're just asking for more trouble.

 

Their parents can say they should say it, but they have no right to make them. I don't give a flying crap if parents have a problem with me telling their kids they can refuse to say it.

 

I give you a semester in the school system before getting fired.

 

Sorry, but I don't support child abuse. Making kids go along with your religious and political values is abusive. I dare parents to complain about me because I told their kid the pledge is optional. If their child wants to say it, then it shouldn't matter.

 

Comparing parents who would prefer to discuss political matters in on their own time and own way to parents who physically harm and neglect their children is truly astonishing.

Sometimes I think you're being this obtuse as a joke or something.

 

A political discussion would be me telling why I don't say the pledge. Telling them they don't have to is legal fact.

 

that's rich, considering your past.

 

And again you ignore the entire point of the comment to nitpick something inconsequential.
:wow:

 

You are scary.

 

But it's ok if they go along with yours?

 

I have come to the conclusion that you aren't real, this is a game to you, (hopefully) you will never be a teacher, and who knows about being a parent. You can do lots of things, but pretending to want help when you are simply baiting and then twisting every single thing said, well, I know when I've been had. Please do us the favor of staying closed the next time the thread is shut down. Of course, that is just my personal opinion, which I am certain you would agree that I am entitled to.

 

Be careful where you use that term. I don't find concerned parents to be a joke. I take concerned parents very seriously. As a parent I would be less than thrilled to find out you were referring to me in a joking manner especially if it relates to me being a concerned parent.

Until you have walked in the shoes of a concerned parent you will have no idea as to how hurtful that term is to all parents.

 

OP, if you think, as a new teacher, that telling students they have the right right not to say the Pledge is a good idea; well, that lets me know that I don't want to hear anymore of your ideas. Your judgment is not the best.

I think you're lost in the sauce ... or just sauced.

 

I don't know why I get concerned over the idea of you teaching. I find that happening to be extremely unlikely.

 

I would bet that most secondary students are aware that saying it is optional.

If this is a hill you're willing to die on, go for it. you speak in a lot of "shoulda-s." Life just doesn't work that way. Stand up for every single belief you hold, if you choose. But remember, very few martyrs hold steady jobs.

 

SF_Giants66, here's the reality--whether you choose to believe or accept it or not. Teaching is all about communication and relationships--with students, colleagues, parents, administrators and the public. There isn't a minute of my day at work when I don't need to be aware of how I am presenting myself. My students are in grades 7 and 8. I teach them several subjects, including Math, English, Health and the Arts. The most important thing that I try to teach them, though, is how to be a responsible, respectful person. They learn that they can think whatever they want to, but it isn't always appropriate to share their opinions publicly. They learn about how to show respect for the opinions and beliefs of others. They learn tolerance and acceptance. They learn these things because I model them every.single.minute. I live it, as do my colleagues.

Last night, we had Meet the Teacher night. I spoke to well over 60 parents, individually, over the course of a couple of hours. All went smoothly, but I do have a couple of parents who can be challenging. Even if they had decided to be less than pleasant last evening, I would have been respectful and polite. I would not have demanded that they, "get the f***" out of my room. Professionals, particularly those charged with educating children, don't do that.

If you do get through your program and do manage to secure a teaching position, if you are as confrontational and narrowly focused as you show here, it will be a very, very short period of time before the administration, and higher up, will be inundated with concerns/complaints from parents and colleagues.

You need to remember what someone said earlier, either in this thread or your previous one, as a teacher, you do not teach a subject, you are teaching children.

 

OP, suck it up, humor all the plebes rolleyes in your placement by teaching what they tell you and saying the pledge. Graduate. Then once you get a teaching position and have your own classroom you can do whatever the hell you want (until they fire you, which... they might because you continue to push your opinions)

It really is THAT simple. Under momma and daddy's roof (aka student teaching) you do what they say. Get your own place (teaching position w/ classroom) and do what you want.

But this isn't about the pledge and you know that. Teachers here, who know what they are talking about, are TRYING to get through to you. PLEASE listen.