Just Finished Subtest II

Discussion in 'Multiple Subject Tests' started by nasimi77, May 21, 2005.

  1. nasimi77

    nasimi77 Groupie

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    May 21, 2005

    Hola. Well, I just finished Subtest II, and I feel like a walking zomibe. I am exhausted! I studied until I thought my head would explode. I feel very close to "Tim and Moby" on Brainpop.com now. ;-) Ok, here's my rant: I feel quite confident about the test as a whole (however, the multiple choice Science seemed extra hard this time) but I got one particular constructed response I had no clue about....but I bs'd the best I could. Out of the 4 times I've taken this (sigh) this time I feel that I did the best, but then again, who knows. I missed the last two times by TWO points (got 218's on my 2nd and 3rd attempt) so I'll be very curious to see what happens this time. I hope you ALL did good! :) We can relax now, well, for a bit. (this is the part I hate, waiting four weeks, feels like 4 months). Ok, time for a nap! Peace out~Nasmimi77
     
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  3. Rose33

    Rose33 Rookie

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    May 21, 2005

    This was my first time taking the test and I felt the Science was easy, but I had a difficult time with the math. It seemed I didn't study enough for the math. I also messed up on the spinner and probability question. Oh I hope I passed. I want to thank all those who contributed to the discussion. It really helped me out with the science part. Thanks again
     
  4. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Funny how we all have our strengths and weaknesses. This was my first time as well. Math is my best subject so I breezed through that. Science is another story though. I think I did okay on the science multiple choice. But I flubbed one of the science essays and had to make an educated guess on the other. Now comes the fun part. Waiting....
     
  5. nasimi77

    nasimi77 Groupie

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    I have taken the math/science test uh, well a few times now. I've noticed that some versions have "easier" math, some have "easier", science, or, more do_able subjects is another way to put it. I got a science constructed response on paramecium that I had never seen before, nor have I seen it in any of the study guides I've purchased. Makes me wonder if they are just throwing it out there as a "tester" to see who knew it. Your right veg guy, now comes the "fun" part, waiting. In the meantime, enjoy your summer. That is what I plan on doing. I have stressed out way to much over this exam, and it's really not worth it. I'm also trying to gain a more positive attitude about the whole thing. Yeah it sucks, yeah it costs way to darn much, yes it's totally ridiculous, yet we must take it and pass it...there's no way around it. I have become a better test taker because of it, and on top of that I am a better math/science teacher, go figure. Anyhow, Good luck to all!
    Nasimi77
     
  6. Eki75

    Eki75 Rookie

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    OMG, I did the same thing. I am usually a whiz at math so I didn't review much, but the last part of the last essay I totally wrote the wrong answer. When I was writing it, I thought "that can't be right, but I guess it is." So I went on to test III. Then handed in the darn thing and waled to my car and it hit me. DER!!! Oh well, hopefully I wrote enough about the first 3/4 of the question to get at least a 2. Also, I had a brain fart about co-ordinates as to whether they were (x,y) or (y,x). Luckily, a previous problem had enough information for me to figure it out by plugging in answers. Gawd, I am glad that's over. Now to sit and wait for the scores. Let's all keep our fingers crossed!!!
     
  7. megereese

    megereese Rookie

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    May 22, 2005


    How many times have you taken it? I agree with you it has taken me awhile to just get over it. I am not completly over it. Ironically when studying I learned some history on the nickel and I am teaching a few lessons on the nickel next week( I teach K ( the nikel is the hardest one for them to reconize and I am going to discuss a few points on what I learned. Is this what makes me a "highly qulaified teacher" ? :p I know we are life learners and all that great stuff. It is just a stressful situation to be in: Money, time, energy and confidence!
     
  8. megereese

    megereese Rookie

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    I took both subset I and II. My intent was to focus on nailing the history, but crazy enough I took the math/science just to see what it was like and will take that in July. I too was baffled to the same part in the math. I ended up leaving it blank. I started freaking out that I was leaving areas blank, but I kept reminding myself this was my strategy. I had not studied at all for this section. I signed up for the trest two weeks late because a future employer urged me to take it in may rather than July? Unfortunatly I will have to keep studying like I did not pass it beacause it won't give me enough time to study for the next if I find out I did not pass. This is one time I am going to really need the summer off. I really do wish everyone the best of luck in passing. I would'nt wish this process on my worst enemy. I am having my mom type me up an outline I recieved in Mr. Zarillos prep class at Cal State Hayward. I will fill in all the juicy details from my notes I will be happy to share with anyone when it is done. We are all in this together :p Thats one thing we teachers are good at is being resourceful, lets use eachother to get through this.
     
  9. sunnydayjim

    sunnydayjim New Member

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    It was my first time taking section II and I'm feeling fussy as to how well I did. I think I did ok on the Math but I completly feel clueless as to the science. I know I fumbled the Paramecia Question. I gave it my best guess. However, when I got home and looked up the answer I wasn't even close. Now only waiting........
     
  10. nasimi77

    nasimi77 Groupie

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    Yeah, gotta love that blasted Paramecium question. That was some major BS'n I wrote.
     
  11. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Megereese, your studying brought you something you're using with your students already? That is SO cool! (And, yes, "highly qualified".) I bet you could weave a story about that into a Subtest III answer (human development), or even Subtest II.

    Why do you think K students have such a hard time with the nickel?
     
  12. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Actually I didn't think the Paramecium question was that bad, though like nasimi77 I had to do some BSn on it. It was the other science question I was cluelesss on. Actually I thought it was incredibly poorly worded. It seemed to me that they asked the same question three different ways. I'm just hoping that I'll get one point on that essay.
     
  13. nasimi77

    nasimi77 Groupie

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    The other science question: Are you talking about the one where a scientists pours a substance into a glass tube w/another substance? Yes, I found that question to be poorly worded as well, and the question did seem repetative. I didn't do so badly on that one, I knew the answer, but I swear sometimes the way they write these questions makes one wonder. I have just never seen that Paramecium question before, and I don't even recall seeing it in any of the study notes I have. Oh well, now I know just in case I have to take the math/science section again. (hopefully not!)
     
  14. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Yes, that's the one. It's funny how they talk about not wanting us to reveal test questions because it costs them so much money to develop the test. Please!!! I know a lot about test development and these tests are so poorly developed it's laughable. The state got ripped off big time by NES!

    Anyway, in some of the now deleted posts there was mention of a Paramecium question, but no one ever gave any useful details about the question.
     
  15. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    May 27, 2005

    please post some of the subtest II questions from 5-21-05 test

    I am so happy for you and hope you nailed it this time. i have to take subtest II again july 16th and pass in order to do my student teaching. so what are some of the questions on both math and science. the paranecium question i looked up in the dictionary, and it is one of the single celled fresh climate protozoens. is that what you all learned later too? what about the science contructed responces?
     
  16. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    do you remember any questions from subtest II?

    hi sunny day, i hope you passed! i have passed both subtest I and III and III was ofcourse the easiest! but subtest II i missed by 10 points, i didn't know much about slopes, and possibly the science and math constructed responses were hard for me. i think i was too wordy. i know what many of you mean about the way they word the questions. crazy making! i have to pass in order to student teach, i've already lost 16 weeks because of subtest II. can anyone help with posting the questions you might remember? I need/ want to get finished already, and get hired hopefully soon.
     
  17. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    10 points is pretty close, Forget-me-not, especially if you were taking all three subtests. Don't lose hope!

    One trick with science is to think about things in the real world that the question reminds you of. If two liquids are poured together, are they going to behave more like tea in water, or are they going to behave more like homemade salad dressing?

    I notice you mentioned you "didn't" know much about slopes. Do you still have questions, or is that all right now?
     
  18. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Wish I could help you Forget-Me-Not but note the warning at the top of the board. Posting of actual test questions is prohibited. There are plenty of good resources out there to help you learn the information: the CSET study guides, Brainpop, the Hirsch books, etc.
     
  19. nasimi77

    nasimi77 Groupie

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    Veg Guy: Yeah I think NES is a joke. It amazes me our "quality" as teachers is so heaviliy measured by these folks. More like annoying. Oh well, what can we do? Just remain as positive as possible, and do our best. That's all anyone can do really. As far as the Paramecium, I suppose if I do a Google search I'll find some good info. There's stuff out there. Right now I'm just trying to get ready to take Subetest I. I'm wondering if Brainpop.com is a good source for that. Seems like they have a lot on English and Social Studies/History. Feels like I'm perpetually studying for an exam all the time.
     
  20. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    yes i do still need clarification, and a few examples to look at please. i also need help about how they want us to respond to the constructed responses, because i feel i gave way too much information than needed, and that might have worked against me. anything will be helpful, i need to pass to do student teaching in the fall!
     
  21. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    why did you think the science was easy? can you clarify? i need to know what kind of info would be helpful to study, because i over studied for subtest II. i tend to overprepare, and then get overwhelmed.
     
  22. Eki75

    Eki75 Rookie

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    I would suggest the Cliff's book. It has examples and instructions for successful constructed response answers. I found it very helpful.
     
  23. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    The constructed responses are SHORT answers - scorers have no way to know how many subtests a person took, so they assume everybody was taking all three subtests, which means there really isn't much time per constructed response. There also isn't much space: the answer sheet gives a block 18 lines deep. Be brief - if you're writing introduction and conclusion, you're writing too much.

    As you start thinking about a question, decide which basic principles - "Big Ideas" - it is about. One of Newton's laws of motion? Plate tectonics? Metamorphosis? Speciation? Whatever it is, try to name it somewhere in your answer, preferably close to the beginning. Use the technical vocabulary that belongs to it - if you're discussing Newton's Second Law of Motion, the law of Constant Acceleration, you have to mention force and mass and acceleration, and either you have to show how they're involved or you need to come up with an example with which you can discuss them.

    (This means, of course, that you have to know the basic principles. Make up your own flashcards and carry them around with you, and look for examples of the principles as you go through daily life. Driving a car is FULL of examples of physics; cooking is chemistry - you get the idea. Kids' science books can be very helpful this way, especially the ones that have kid-friendly experiments in them.)

    And offer examples, the sort of examples that would help make the terms and the principles clear enough to a reasonably bright fifth or sixth grader.
     
  24. RBundgard

    RBundgard New Member

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    Jun 8, 2005

    nascimi77 wrote. . . as far as the Paramecium, I suppose if I do a Google search I'll find some good info. I thought you might find the following information useful:

    Paramecium, a genus of protozoa of the phylum Ciliophora are often called slipper animalcules because of their slipperlike shape. They are unicellular, single cell, organisms usually less than 0.25 mm (0.01 in) in length. Paramecia are covered with minute hairlike projections called cilia, which function in locomotion and during feeding. During feeding the cilia move bacteria, other small protozoa or decaying matter toward the oral groove found approximately along the center of the animal. When moving through the water, paramecia follow a spiral path while rotating on the long axis. When a paramecium encounters an obstacle, it exhibits the so-called avoidance reaction: It backs away at an angle and starts off in a new direction. Paramecia feed mostly on bacteria, which are driven into the gullet by the cilia.

    Two contractile vacuoles regulate osmotic pressure and also serve as excretory structures. A paramecium has a large nucleus called a macronucleus, without which it cannot survive, and one or two small nuclei called micronuclei, without which it cannot reproduce sexually.

    Reproduction
    Paramecium has two means of reproduction, simple division and conjugation.
    A. Division. In favorable conditions the cell divides in two by a process called binary fission. This forms two new cells, each of which rapidly grows any new structures required and increases in size.
    B. Conjugation. This is a more complicated method. It involves two cells coming together to exchange nuclear material; in other words, each cell goes through a form of sexual reproduction whereby the animals share genetic material with each other. The two cells then separate and continue to reproduce by simple division. It is similar in some ways to sexual reproduction in more complex animals.

    Although one species lives in marine waters, Paramecia are numerous in freshwater ponds throughout the world. They are easily cultivated and widely used in research.

    Remember, Your short constructed responses need to show purpose, knowledge, and support. Also, you will need to utilize the vocabulary one would expect to hear from a professional working in the particular field from which the question is drawn.

    Best wishes and good luck!
    Rachel
     
  25. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    thank you, that was an awesome explamation.
     
  26. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    what other science question are you talking about?
     
  27. RBundgard

    RBundgard New Member

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    Hi Forget-me-not,

    You are most welcome. I hope the information regarding Paramecia is helpful to someone in the future. I do not know to which other science question you refer, and so, I cannot be helpful there.
     
  28. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Rachel's explanation IS awesome, isn't it?

    To do well on the Purpose rubric, respond to the question as it is stated, bringing in any larger issues that it impinges on. For instance, if the question asks about Paramecium's habitat, the fact that Paramecium moves around with cilia (which you can imagine as little oars, sort of like a Roman war galley that's rowed) is worth mentioning because it clearly means that Paramecium is aquatic, but the fact that Paramecium has two different kinds of nucleus, though really striking, probably doesn't need to be mentioned.
     
  29. RBundgard

    RBundgard New Member

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    Jun 8, 2005

    Dear TeacherGroupie,

    You may be correct with respect to not needing to mention the two different kinds of nuclei found in the genus Paramecium, though it does speak to the fact the they have both sexual (meiosis) and asexual (mitosis) reproduction, which would significantly impact their ability to build in population in rapid order. Interestingly only the ciliates, of all the eukaryotes, have both a macronucleus, which functions as storage for DNA in its haploid state for the purpose of meiosis, and the micronucleus functions to enable the animal to reproduce through nuclear fission (mitosis), thus the genetic materials contained at this site are diploid in nature.

    Incidently, it would probably be wise to be familiar with the various stages of both meiosis and mitosis. I know if I were building this exam, I may very well ask questions regarding reproduction.

    Good luck and best wishes,
    Rachel
     
  30. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Forget-Me-Not: By the "other science question", I mean the other constructed science question that was on the May test. I can't really give any details since that's now prohibited, but if you read through this entire post there's a little information about it.

    BTW, in my opinion (and I could be completely wrong), the Paramecium question wasn't about Paramecium per se, but was rather an opportunity to talk about broader scientific issues. The question could have just as easily used elephants. So while Rachel provides some great information, I'm not sure it could be used to answer the question. I could be wrong though.
     
  31. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Rachel, I can't agree more that it makes sense to know mitosis and meiosis (which are discussed to death on a different thread on this forum).

    But Veg_guy's point is very well made, especially since the answer space for CSET-Multiple Subjects constructed responses is limited: one needs to focus on the key concepts for the question that's been asked.
     
  32. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    teacher groupie you take the edge off with these kind of responses. thank you soooo much!
     
  33. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    hi there! :confused: could you explain the about the scientists pouring the two substance in depth please. are you talking about measuring the wieght of something, or volume? sciende is the hard subject and math too, and i must pass in order for everything to flow this fall and student teach, i already lost 16 weeks because of subtest II.
     
  34. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    hi teachergroupie, can you give us a good strategy for studying daily starting now for july 16's test date. i only have subtest II to pass, and like i have mentioned before i only missed subtest II by 10 points. what does that exactly look like in trems of questions? is that two constructed responses, or five multiple choice questions? i think if i have an idea of what i need to do to measure up, or step up to the plate, it might make a difference somehow. does it seem like i am grasping for straws? i just want to nail this subtest II with mostly four stars for each (math and science), and i too feel very insecure because of all this testing. i can't wait till i can take a deep breath and the testing is over!!!!!! this is the last test to go...the rica was a piece of cake compared to the cset tests. thank you so much for any help you can give me. i love your explanations!
     
  35. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    do you think they want us to know each stage in both? i thought they just wanted us to know that one is sexual and the other asexual. i haven't studied the stages, but if that is required i will. i can use little memonic devices to remember the stages, for example, :p "resting in phoenix (my)aunt talks", for mitosis.
     
  36. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Flattery will get you everywhere, forget-me-not...

    Remember that these subtests are scored holistically: the scorers don't care how you get your 220-or-more points as long as you get 'em.

    Now a disclaimer: there isn't an exact correspondence between scaled score and numbers of questions, because questions aren't exactly equivalent in difficulty. (Try writing a series of test questions, and you'll see why.)

    We can, however, get a general idea what the average question is worth. Multiple choice counts for 70% of each CSET-MS subtest. There are 52 multiple choice questions in Subtest II. Each multiple choice question therefore is worth 70%/52 of available points - just under 1.5% of the total. You can calculate the average number of scaled points per question by finding 70% of the total available scaled points (hint: it's NOT 300) and them multiplying that by 1.5%. Use the same logic to figure out what each constructed response is worth.

    Spend at least some of your study time DOING science and thinking about real-world examples and applications. Field trips can be helpful. I haven't been to the California Oil Museum in Santa Paula (http://www.oilmuseum.net), but it would have to be a great place to learn about geology and friction! (Sometimes we like friction and sometimes we don't. Think about when and why.) The Santa Barbara Natural History Museum (http://www.sbnature.org) sounds promising - it includes a planetarium, and there's a Sea Center at Stearns Wharf. I found these listed in Susan Peterson's FUN AND EDUCATIONAL PLACES TO GO WITH KIDS AND ADULTS IN SOUTHERN CALIFORNIA - great book, but it doesn't hurt to check the Internet for hands-on science museums in case there are things that got left out of the book. Before you go, make yourself a study guide - could be a notebook, could be index cards - write a Big Principle of Science on each, then as you go through the museum, identify activities or exhibits that touch on each principle and jot them down under their principle.

    Kids' books on science often contain neat experiments you can do at home (and adapt to your classroom, right?) And as you go through daily life, keep using your study guide. There's amazingly much science in cooking and driving...

    Hope this helps.
     
  37. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Jun 11, 2005

    I wouldn't worry about it. Since it was on the May subtest, you won't see it on the July one.
     
  38. TeacherGroupie

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    Perhaps not in exactly that form, but the question is probably keying on density, diffusion, and/or viscosity - density in particular is a Big Principle. Homemade salad dressing is a great example.

    (If I were NES and had multiple versions of this test, I wouldn't give them in strict calendar rotation.)
     
  39. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Boy it's frustrating not being able to talk about the actual questions and instead having to beat around the bush. All I can say is the question had nothing to do with density, diffusion, viscosity, etc. Of course those are important principles to study regardless...

    As far as not using a strict calendar rotation goes, I agree completely Teacher Groupie. And yet NES does appear to be following some sort of rotation pattern, particularly with the constructed response questions.
     
  40. veg_guy

    veg_guy Rookie

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    Forget-Me-Not: If, as you suggest, both math and science pose challenges for you, I would suggest concentrating your studying on math. Math is basically a set of rules: learn the rules and learn how to apply them and you can do great. Spend a lot of time looking over the answers to the practice tests in the study guides and understand how an answer was arrived at. But don't limit yourself to the CSET study guides. Math is math so look over practice tests in CBEST books, GRE books, etc. And look over textbooks used in elementary and middle school math, particularly those that focus on story problems. Finally, if you want someone to tutor you, it's probably going to be a lot easier to find someone who can tutor you in math than in science. I'm not saying to ignore science, just that I think it's easier to increase your math proficiency.
     
  41. forget-me-not

    forget-me-not Rookie

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    thanks to you both! i agree that the math is the toughest to score higher on. i find it interesting what you both said about there being some sort of order of the tests. that has been said in previous thresds, and i even tried to find the formula....ha ha...that is a probablity problem isn't it!? well i have decided to study at least two hours a day, even if that includes looking over children's science excperiments, and math games. i have been to the santa barbara natural history museum, but not the santa paula oil one. i do have to get tar in santa paula this next week to retar my asfault driveway. is this in anyway a principle in science? well thank you for your help again, i am going to nail this test this time...the second time taking the test is going to be a charm!!!!! :p
     

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