Discussion in 'Job Seekers' started by bros, Oct 7, 2014.
Nov 5, 2014
Motion made to close this thread....... Just close this.... Please....
I'd have to agree, not that I think my opinion means squat. :lol:
Were there more advice that could be given, I'd say leave it open, but at this point, is there anything left to be said? The interview he wanted help with has been completed, and this has gone from a "help me with an upcoming interview" to "help me with anything and everything from buying clothes to finding transportation."
Bros I wish I was in one of your classes. We have definentley covered PARRC. I realize your student teaching was limited but did you talk to your CT. I attend Kean and am in junior field and the knowledge I have learned from my CT is incredible. Im already taking over the classroom and have been asked back for my senior field. As everyone says you need to ask, it won't be handed to you on a silver platter. NJ is a tough market. I'm afraid when I graduate but you need to help yourself to. Still rooting for you.
Nov 6, 2014
About halfway through the Daily 5 book.
Never read any Fountas and Pinnell books.
First thought in my mind "Wait, isn't that some handwriting style or something?"
Then the second thought was "Oh wait, that's a reading level thing, I read about it on here in a topic somewhere around 16 months ago."
I know where my weaknesses lie in content, too. Primarily in non-elementary math. In pedagogy, my biggest weakness is probably classroom management.
I thought I gave really too answers to this interviewer too. During the itnerview, my thoughts in my head were "Answer the questions with complete sentences, try to suppress your nervous habits as much as you can, maintain eye contact, remember to bring up your disabilities (but don't talk too much or too long about them), and remember to ask a question."
The funny thing is I had questions in my head at the start of the interview and when I was asked if I had any questions, my mind just went blank.
Seeing my therapist simply would've reduced the level of anxiety. I did feel somewhat comfortable during this interview, however, even though I did not know the individual interviewing me, or much about the district other than general knowledge of the area and what I had gleaned from their website.
With weaknesses, it depends on what you are asking about - we already know my physical weaknesses. Mentally, I have a major tendency to withdraw socially when things get hard, I also have a habit of obsessing with my medical issues, and I have some minor issues with aggression.
With teaching, my weaknesses are in classroom management (including, but not limited to, ability to change the tone of my voice to aid in classroom management) and verbally communicating with colleagues and superiors, I would imagine.
With regards to constructive criticism, it feels, at times, like I am being attacked. On the other hand, I know you are trying to help me, so there is a bit of cognitive dissonance going on.
It was the only state university that would've been covered by NJ DVR with me having to take out the least in loans (And it being easily accessible via train and not having a very large campus was very much a deciding factor - at least for my parents). Rutgers was way too expensive and NJDVR doesn't cover private schools.
I want a teaching job. I believe that if I give it my all, which I would, I would be an excellent teacher for a class full of students and I would be a decent role model for my students.
Then you are going to respond with something along the lines of "Given your current levels of anxiety/mental state/whatever, do you think you would be able to give it your all in a classroom if you were offered a teaching job tomorrow, let's just say a teacher had to take a sudden leave of absence and the district wants you to take the job for some reason?"
I'd probably respond "Well first off, there is no school because of the teacher's convention. However, if someone were there making calls for some reason, I'd tell the district yes, but then after getting off the phone, I would probably have a little, someone might describe it as a panic attack. I would have a million and one questions after processing it, I would research the district/teacher to see what I would be taking over and I would try to maintain continuity in the classroom (Classroom Management/Rules, Style of instruction, etc.) to the best of my ability. But in the end, I think I would be able to do it."
I didn't mean to go off on a tangent like this, but that is what I do. Better than the other tangent that was floating my mind. So many different possible scenarios go through my head at once, it is rather distracting. Anxiety sucks at times. See - there I go trying to garner a modicum of sympathy, which will not work after 40 pages of talking about various topics revolving around the same central topic: "At this point in time, would bros be able to be successful in the classroom in any capacity where he would be either the sole or one of few, adults in a classroom of children, of whom at least one (in the case of a para position), if not all, would depend on his competency and confidence in his own abilities as an educator."
Some of the politics surrounding the university the last few years have not been exactly beneficial to the students - or any in the university community.
So the theory you posit is that I do not want to be a teacher nor am I able to comprehend what it takes to be considered a qualified and competitive candidate for a teaching position.
I finished my pedagogical courses (except student teaching/capstone) in Fall 2012, taking the majority of them Fall 2011-Spring 2012.
I did my first junior field experience Fall 2012. I asked my CT if I could do more with my lessons, she would always say not unless it was a project that she had already done in previous years with students - all of which were things like Arts & Crafts, which I would've had to prepare in advance at home, which I would've been unable to do at home or assist the students in class because I do not have the motor skills to do that. I can't even use scissors.
The University Supervisor for that field experience told me at my second to last evaluation that he didn't believe that a person who cannot write should teach, and he gave me a 24/40.
I did my second junior field Spring 2013. I had a different CT and a different supervisor. I taught less lessons during my second junior field (6 versus 10), due to the fact that my CT broke her leg one weekend, and I had to miss two weeks of field, then they had to make other arrangements until the CT was able to return, and I was told to sit in a classroom two days twice a week and just observe, my supervisor said it would be a good chance to see a different style of classroom management and it was (however, I wasn't allowed to teach any lessons in this time). After the CT came back, there were only a few more weeks of the semester and she had to play catch-up, so the only times I could teach were when my supervisor was coming and nothing else. In that field experience, I got a 35/40 from my CT and supervisor.
I was never allowed to take over the classroom during any of my experiences. As stated previously, and by many others, my experiences have been atypical.
Are you at a PDS school?
Bros, you do not have a job. As far as I can tell, your household responsibilities are fairly minimal. You do want to get a job.
Start spending 8 hours a day on the job front. That could involve reading education related books (just a tip here... you aren't going to get a job involving elementary reading if you don't have at least a working knowledge of the work of Fountas and Pinnell. That is not in any way an exaggeration... if you went through college without needing at least two of their books, then they set you up for failure). You can watch education-related videos. You can do resume-building. Volunteer. Apply for jobs. Do independent research. This site does not count towards that time.
There are tons of options out there for you, but start getting in the habit of starting at 8:00, working until 5:00, take a half hour for lunch and two fifteen minute breaks whenever you need them. There are multiple reasons for this, but the biggest one is that it will get you into the working frame of mind. Also, there are things that you just don't know. I would not be happy if my daughter were in your class today. It's not because of your disabilities. It's because of the things that you don't know that I'd consider a baseline.
Start reading books by F&P. Read some of John Van De Walle's books on teaching mathematics. Read other books on teaching reading. Find "Minds on Mathematics: Using Math Workshop..." It says grades 4-8, but you'll still benefit from it. Read the Jan Richardson book. Start compiling curriculum resources. Plan specific units. No, you might not ever use them, and if you do use them, you'll have to change them dramatically, but just the experience of planning units from start to finish, making sure you cover essential standards... this will benefit you. Do NOT do while while watching tv, or while having Netflix open. If you want to play music, that's fine, but it needs to be music without lyrics. Tchaikovsky would be great. If you need something upbeat, then find a good jazz station (or create one on Pandora). Interviewing would count towards this 8 hours. So would time with your therapist. You can research resources for people with disabilities in other states to help them live independently... I know you don't want to think about this, but ask czacza... finding a job in New Jersey is extremely difficult. As Go Blue, or me for that matter... Finding a job in Maryland, DC, or Virginia is a lot easier. Plus, being capable of living independently is a necessary life skill for a 20-something with a college degree, no matter what your disabilities are.
But the key is spending 8 hours a day working. It won't always be fun, and you'll wish you could stop and play video games. But... well... that's life.
I suspect you'll ignore this advice, or give a reason why it won't work, and that's fine. However... don't sit back and wonder why it's so hard to find a job.
I would argue for keeping the thread open. As confounding as the conversation may seem, there is some truly excellent advice being given here that may help some other pre-service teachers know how to prepare for their own interviews.
There have been many threads giving wonderful advice on interviews. This particular thread has outlived its usefulness and is now just rehashing the same things over and over again.
So books to read/finish reading:
The Daily Five
The CAFE Book
Something by John Van De Walle (How about Teaching Student-Centered Mathematics: Developmentally Appropriate Instruction for Grades 3-5 (Volume II))
Minds on Mathematics
Something by Jan Richardson? (The Next Step in Guided Reading?)
I know that getting a job in NJ as a teacher is difficult and that my disabilities make it even more difficult.
But I also know and accept that at least right now, I would not be able to handle living alone.
I am aware that classroom management is huge, hence my trying to get put on sub lists. My afternoon CT for student teaching said that I should sub a bit to help improve my classroom management skills.
The social withdrawal is more something that happens over an extended period of time, not instantly. The aggression is something that was only noticed by my 2010 neuropsych evaluation and it was listed as being only slightly elevated from normal levels.
Obsession over my medical issues is less a compulsive thing, more that it is always present in my mind in some form or another.
The Marshall Rubric sounds fun. I think the districts near me do something called... Danielson?
Also Fountas and Pinnell. I'd probably put that as your top priority. And 8 hours a day. Honestly and sincerely.
Any chance an ebook is available of any Fountas and Pinnell books?
Dunno, bros. How could you find out?
It took me 30 seconds to find a whole bunch of F&P ebooks.
Bros...I think people have been enabling you for far too long in your life and on the forums. You seem to be a techie of sorts...hit Google.
Exactly what I'm thinking. You have such great advice for people when it comes to technical problems, computer issues, etc...but come on, you KNOW how to figure out if there's an ebook. There's no excuse for that. It takes about 30 seconds to Google an answer, and that's chump change for someone who just "sits around and does nothing on the internet all day" (your quote, not mine).
Having everything you do as a professional educator reduced to a number is anything but fun.
And yes, some NJ districts are using Danielson.
In the future, I will name all my threads "I have an interview on Thursday" and guarantee myself gobs of useful responses.
You're on a good path, PChang. You don't need this level of advice.
Wishing you and all who are truly able to make a difference for students all the best of luck!
Not if you don't want us recoiling, you won't, cupcake.
By the way, your current inquiry has got some answers.
Nov 7, 2014
I was just wondering. Sorry for asking a harmless question?
Anyway, I looked, saw that it is mostly prompting guides (Which don't seem to be what I would need to get a foundation on what their books cover, seems more for the implementation of it), the book Literacy Beginnings (which is for PreK-K), or When Readers Struggle (which is for K-3)
I was just wondering if anyone knew where to get an ebook of it - Since there's this Heinemann site I found, which is probably jacking up prices because it's run by book companies and there's also amazon, which some publishers dislike putting ebooks on because amaazon likes to charge a lower price than what the publishers suggest.
I was attempting to some sarcasm.
Perhaps I should use italics next time.
Thursday is certainly a popular day for me to have interviews - that is weird. Have all of my interviews been on Thursdays? First one was a Friday, second was a Thursday, third was a Thursday, and the fourth was a Monday. I don't think i'm missing any of the interviews there. So i've had 50% of them on Thursdays.
Yes, another thread about someone having an interview on Thursday might send some posters here into a catatonic state.
Either that, or reading the thread title, then running away from the computer before any hair needs to be ripped out of their head.
I just hope that all of you understand that I want to succeed in this profession and I am trying my best to follow all of your advice.
With some people, you hear them say the reason they wanted to be a teacher was because their parent was a teacher or that when they were a kid, all they did during pretend play was pretending to be a teacher. With me, it was a bit different, I wasn't really... there for most of my early years, as I understand it (as stated many times before, my first memory is at the age of 6) - due to significant developmental delays. However, there was always one thing I was really good at after the wonderful SLP who worked for my school district was able to get me to the point where I was somewhat understandable by teachers was helping the other kids in my self contained multiply handicapped class. I could understand what they were saying and communicate that to the teachers, which I believe they appreciated (I know my old special education teacher remembered it). However, I don't remember much of that, just bits and pieces from 1st grade, and a little bit of it in 2nd grade. Throughout my K-12 education, I was usually involved with my fellow students with disabilities in some capacity - either in resource room (through sixth grade) or in 7th-12th grade, standardized tests and Adaptive PE. Through my experiences, I grew accustomed to helping out my fellow students with disabilities, especially during high school, when they would have trouble with things like math that they were learning (One time, one of them was trying to figure out the age of a celebrity they were obsessed with - they knew the year of birth, but not the age, and I helped them turn it into a math problem, which they were able to solve with a little bit of help). I was always very kind of helpful to my fellow students with disabilities, even the rude ones, such as one individual in my HS Adaptive PE class who refused to talk to "those kinds of people" (students with mild intellectual disabilities), because she only wanted to talk to people "like you and me" (Referring to herself and me, people who were mainstreamed except for Adaptive PE) - and my response was that she should apologize to them, because that was just a rude thing to say at any time, especially when they were sitting right next to her. I could also go into how my first special education teacher is an amazing woman who is the reason why I have gotten as far as I have - or I could talk about how I want to teach to prevent students from being treated like I was in school, just because I was disabled - everyone would always second guess me and underestimate my abilities, which sort of led to me doing that with myself a little bit (more than a little bit, quite a bit, or rather, frequently, as I am sure all of you are... disgustingly familiar with - that sounds like a good way to phrase it I think. Or perhaps intimately familiar with, as using 'quite' again would be rather repetitive and make for a boring sentence.)
And that's a great story, but I'm still not seeing how you're remotely prepared to be a teacher. Your ST was atypical, you've never had complete control of a classroom, you have no job experience of any kind, and instead of being grateful for the advice that people are taking to give to you, you come back either sarcastic or defensive or with excuses. Sorry, but I'm not buying it. I foresee us having this same conversation with you in another 6 months.
Quit wasting our time. Sh*t or get off the pot. Do something or find another profession.
So you were serious about not knowing how to look for an ebook (something someone as adept at technology usage as you should be able to navigate) but sarcastic about a rubric listing essential skills by which NJ teachers are evaluated?
The story was because people here say they don't understand why I want to be a teacher - perhaps that helped a bit in illustrating the why.
I am grateful for the advice.
So I am not able to state a reason why I am not able to accomplish a particular thing at that specific point in time?
When would I have gotten any job experience? High school, there were no jobs I could've done (and I was much much worse anxiety-wise than I am now). When I was in community college, the same thing - no jobs I could've done. When I was at the four year university, the only job I could've possibly done was substituting, but at the time, most of the districts in my area were looking for subs with teaching certificates - or if they weren't, they weren't looking for subs at the time.
Or if they were looking for subs, they were looking during one of my field experiences.
I was simply wondering if anyone knew a good place for educational ebooks aside from the two sites I have mentioned, as I am not very familiar with getting educational ebooks outside of amazon.
So I was seeing if anyone might've had an idea as to other places I could check, other than amazon, that site, and my local public library.
Of course I could do a google search to figure it out, but if I could just ask the question and someone goes "Oh yeah, I got that in eBook form at <site>." or "Yeah, i've never been able to find an eBook copy of that." then that just solves the issue for me - also for anyone viewing this in the future, they can have multiple sites to check for eBooks, as I know this site is heavily indexed by google and other search engines, so this topic may come up if someone is searching this site through google for professional development texts.
Just sounds like a bunch of excuses...
Yes, of course! Being disabled is an excuse for not being able to work! It's all a plot by people with disabilities everywhere!
I was legitimately unable to hold or maintain any kind of employment during HS or Community College.
When I started to attend the four year school, the only job I could've potentially performed was substitute teaching, however, I was taking classes 3-4 days a week and I preferred doing well in [the majority of] my classes over earning money that I wouldn't even really spend anyway.
And there was not one single school or organization near your college that you could not have volunteered at for a few hour a month?
Good grief! My son is disabled and will never live on his own, go to college, or even speak to people outside the family and he was able to volunteer while he was in his high school special ed classes.
Well actually, bros, you're the only disabled person I've ever met that uses his disability as a crutch. I see plenty of disabled people working and being active members of society every day.
Experience does not need to come in the form of payment. A lot of my experience was on a voluntary basis. You didn't have to hold down a job, I mean you could've joined a club in high school or college. Classes 3-4 days a week?! Oh boy ok... One of those days you totally could've subbed especially since you didn't need the money for a real job. Bros, teaching isn't a 3-4 day a week job... How are you going to manage that when you make it seem like classes 3-4 days a week was a lot? A class lasts... A couple hours a day? For me personally, I am finding teaching SO much more exhausting and demanding than I found college. Yes, you wanted to do well in college, but you really HAVE to do well teaching. The lesson plans are no longer for a grade, they're for real individuals you are responsible for. Much more work and pressure, in my opinion.
I worked at the library in college. Most of it was assisting patrons, checking in and out books or laptops, shelving books, etc... It may not have been something you could do, but surely you could've had a student assistant job watching a desk and answering phones? There were plenty of jobs like that at my college. Most students used those jobs to do homework.
To be blunt, bros, I still haven't seen a shred of evidence that you've mastered the FREE links on reading that I posted some time ago. Skimming or scanning won't cut it, buddy: you need to internalize this stuff, so that it can't help but ooze out in your language whenever you discuss reading. The technical terminology of reading is part of the toolkit of teaching, and an elementary teacher who isn't fluent in this "ReadingTeacher-ese" is not going to be taken seriously.
So start with those links. Read them. Reread them. Restate them in your own words. When they mention a term that you aren't ABSOLUTELY certain that you know and could use in a sentence, Google it, and keep Googling it till it makes sense to you and you could explain it to a parent. In the process you'll discover other Web sites that usefully explain reading; use them the same way. And so on. You'll be carving out your own set of go-to references while you enhance your grasp of the concepts. (In the process, you will also almost certainly find references to and restatements of Fountas and Pinnell. Bonus! You're welcome.)
Find videos of reading instruction online - Learner.org, the (FREE) Web site of Annenberg Media, should have whole series on reading instruction methodology at several grade bands, and Reading Rockets (to which I've already given you a link, or you can Google, and it's FREE) has quick videos focusing on particular issues. Watch a video enough times to make a list of the technical terms it uses. (You might start this with Reading Rockets videos oriented to teachers, then graduate up to Learner.org episodes.) Then turn off the sound and watch it again while you provide play-by-play commentary for fellow aficionados (which means using the technical terminology). If you record yourself, listen to your recording and check off how many of the technical terms you managed to weave in; if you got fewer than 2/3, or missed any major ones, try again.
Read and put into practice. Read and find more ways to practice. Read and look for opportunities large and small to practice. That's how learning works.
Wow, TeacherGroupie, that was handing it to him on a silver platter. Very kind of you.
While the great advice on professional books and websites might benefit another candidate, I'm afraid it's wasted here. It's a tough market demanding so much more than one who can simply spew information gleaned from a text. Just as we demand from our students, a candidate must internalize what has been read, discussed, observed or practiced and then rub it up against one's own personal beliefs, theories and philosophies. And then come out with new understandings. That isn't happening here.
a2z, thanks for the compliment (I think). It's of a piece with many of my posts in the Examinations for Teachers forum, but it was faster to repeat a bit than to rummage up one of those to link to.
The only ones I ever saw information for (such as ones with flyers posted around campus or emailed out to education majors) were ones that required me to have a driver's license/be able to drive.
With the community college, it was the only thing around for a while.
Saw more volunteering things at the four year school, but they expected any volunteers to have a car, as something like 90% of students who attend the university commute.
I do not use my disability as a crutch. I simply have realistic expectations. I know how I was then and how I am now.
Would you like me to describe how debilitating my anxiety was when I was in HS and CC (I didn't start seeing therapists until a year into CC and I only found my current therapist after graduating from CC)? It was rather bad.
Now, I am better. My anxiety is still considered severe, but it is managed.
I was in a club in HS. I was in the bowling club. It was fun. The adviser was the self contained teacher for the HS who I believe was involved with my special education preschool education in some capacity.
Any clubs in college met at incredibly inconvenient times (usually during the college hour, which was when the last regular train of the day would leave).
Most days, I would have 1-2 classes a day. My commute would start at 8 in the morning for an 11 AM class, then if I had a class that ended at 1:45, I would leave at 2:40 and get home at 4:30. If I had a class that ended at 3:15, I would have to walk as quickly as I could to the train to catch the 3:30 train, then I would get home at 5:00 PM. Then i'd eat dinner and spend a few hours each night working on homework, then doing the rest of my homework on my days off during the week.
I only had to do lesson plans twice for a grade. It was more to see that we knew how to create a lesson plan than anything. The lesson plans during field experiences were developed collaboratively with the cooperating teacher providing guidance when necessary (At the beginning of my junior field experiences, I needed quite a bit of guidance, but as they progressed, most of the lessons were met with minor critiques, such as how to extend student learning with a particular lesson. During my student teaching, the one comment they had near the beginning of student teaching was that I had a bit of difficulty adjusting to the Kindergarten curriculum, but those worries were gone by the time of the midterm evaluation - as most of their worries by then were related to my ability to motivate/engage students outside of the use of technology and behavior management skills).
Student teaching was easier for me to handle than my classes, however, my experience was atypical and not representative of actual workload. My workload (by the end) consisted of creating four math lessons and two to four science/social studies lessons per week. Throughout my student teaching, I only taught 40 lessons - or an average of 2.85 a week (It's not 2.667~ because I technically only had 14 weeks of student teaching, and if you discount the last week where I taught no lessons, then it is 13 weeks with an average of 3 lessons a week).
During the morning, I only did Math because that was what my cooperating teacher taught - I wasn't allowed to take over anything that the general education teacher taught, or the morning meeting that my cooperating teacher ran, as she "didn't want to just sit around bored all day."
One day a week, the general education teacher ran Math Centers, while she ran a small remediation group, which she never allowed me to observe her doing, despite me asking multiple times if I could observe - she'd have me rotate around the room and make sure that students were staying on task (as the general education teacher would run a small group activity that I could similarly not observe) as the para was frequently out of the room doing tasks for the principal or other teachers.
In the afternoon, frequently they would be continuing a lesson from the morning, usually finishing up a craft - I would assist with that. Most of my time in the afternoon class was spent reading books to the children, as that CT knew that one of my weaknesses was changing tone of voice. Other than that, a lot of afternoons were spent assisting them during center time - when my CT and I would go around the room, monitoring how the students were doing (They would sometimes do activities based on what they had covered that morning, other times they would just be allowed to do lower intensity, but still important activities, such as playing with toys, playing with play-doh, building things with Legos, or engaging in pretend play at the little kitchen). Most afternoons were filled with either finishing up what they had done that morning, specials, or centers. Whenever they didn't have one of those occupying the afternoon, I would teach a lesson, either science or social studies.
It would take me about 25 minutes on average to create a lesson, I would say. If I went heavily on a SMART Board component in the lesson, that would extend the time I would spend on a lesson up to 20-30 minutes.
Answering phones was not one of my strong suits. I am more comfortable with making phone calls now (I don't stutter when talking on the phone anymore, as long as I type out a very rough outline of what I plan to say as an introductory statement). My college was very limited in terms of work study jobs as far as I am aware - most jobs for students who wanted to work on campus were either custodial or culinary. Positions where you sat in an office answering phones either went to graduate students, as part of a graduate assistantship or to people hired to fill such a position permanently - at least to the best of my knowledge. I am not trying to excuse anything, I am just stating what I knew to the extent of my knowledge with regards to the four year school that I attended.
I'm going to search through your posts for links, because the only one I remember you referring me to was freetech4teachers.com which I have looked at quite a bit.
You recommended I look at the wikipedia article on close reading, which I did. You also recommended looking at FCRR (I am familiar with their website and have used it a few times in the past) and SEDL (Not familiar with it, I skipped over it when reading the post, as my eyes jumped immediately to FCRR). In that post, you also recommended Learner.org - which I have looked at briefly. You also referred to Reading Rockets, which I neglected to look at.
Another useful link is TeachingChannel.org
Would you like me to post a daily progress report on what I do and my reflections of what I did that day? Would that prove to you that I care and I want to succeed?
Honestly... yes. I think you doing this would be extremely valuable.
Now... posting it here wouldn't be necessary (unless you really wanted to post it). But I think you keeping a running journal of your education-related activities would be very valuable for yourself. I suspect you'll notice that you are doing more than you are getting credit for here... but less than you are giving yourself credit for.
CTs aren't bored when taking on STs...especially in your home district, bros, where one would think they would support you to the fullest extent...(and yet they still arent accepting sub paperwork? Even when they know you and you did ST there? Somedays i swear we have barely warm bodies subbing in my high stakes district) instead, I view hosting a ST as an opportunity to share my love of this profession, to plan and learn together, to share responsibility, to build our profession...this doesn't always happen given the dynamics, not all my student teachers were well prepared enough to do more than a few carefully controlled lessons..these teachers allowed you to do what they were comfortable with you doing...
No, bros...no schedule of your activities is needed. You want a job for which you seem woefully unprepared. We get the picture. Clearly.
This thread has just become argumentative, so I am going to close it now. Bros, take the advice that you feel is helpful and disregard the rest.
Separate names with a comma.