getting an offer and finding out pay/benefits

Discussion in 'Job Seekers' started by abat_jour, Jul 8, 2014.

  1. abat_jour

    abat_jour Companion

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    If presented with an offer, does the principal know the salary or is this HR's domain?
    Are you supposed to negotiate; for example say I have 300$ month loan repayments, the commute is 45 miles, gasoline is x, thus I request 2k more year?

    how does this work?:yawn:
     
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  3. abat_jour

    abat_jour Companion

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    My school career services person said I should negotiate.
     
  4. teacherintexas

    teacherintexas Maven

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    Is there a pay scale on your district's website? It might be a regional thing, but I've never heard of a teacher negotiating.
     
  5. giraffe326

    giraffe326 Virtuoso

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    This can vary. Take North Carolina, for example. The state mandates the pay scale. There are no negotiations.

    Where I currently live, the only negotiating you can do is for years of experience. In January, when I was hired mid-year, they flat out told me that I would start at the base salary, especially since my years of experience were out of state. My new job credited me 5 years. The P fought for that, not even me. I have 7 years in, but I think 5 is pretty fair. It is about $8000 over base salary.

    Benefits also vary greatly. In NC, the state covered my insurance premiums. Here, I have to pay.


    Frankly, they don't care what kind of debt you have or what your commute is. If we were paid based on that, I'd be making a fortune. The job I am quitting had me commuting 180 miles per day. That is nearly 4000 miles per MONTH!
     
  6. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    Most public districts, along with some private schools and some charters, have district-wide salary schedules. Typically there is no negotiating: you are placed on the salary according to your experience and education. In some districts there might be some leeway for negotiating your experience (step) placement, but in my experience that is fairly rare.

    In any event, I think that asking for a higher salary because of your commute time is ridiculous. A higher salary should be going to the teacher who is best qualified for the job and demonstrates the most success in the classroom, not the teacher who has the farthest drive.
     
  7. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    This.:thumb:
    Social studies, right? Not sure why you think it's 'undervalued', but in most public districts a first year SS teacher is going to be paid commensurately with a first year English (insert any content area here) teacher.
    While your confidence that you are a top 10% candidate is ego boosting, remember you will be in competition with other highly recommended, quailified, well educated and experienced candidates. Most new teachers have student loans, expenses, bills to pay but salary negotiation outside of your starting step placement (pretty much only based on level of education and teaching experience) is negligible and tied to contracted salary guides.
     
  8. LMichele

    LMichele Cohort

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    Agreed. I've never heard of any teacher, especially a new teacher, trying to negotiate their contract. I have student loans and costs associated with commuting, but I can't imagine asking for more pay for those reasons. I chose the university I went to knowing I'd have loans, and I chose to take a job where I did knowing I'd be paying for gas and parking. My job doesn't owe me extra compensation for that.
     
  9. abat_jour

    abat_jour Companion

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    well the bottom line is being able to actually pay rent and get there. a 30k salary when your budget is 800 rent plus utilities, plus loan payments, car payments (no public transit), gas prices. You may want to work them and do the best job ever but it is physically impossible to do.
     
  10. abat_jour

    abat_jour Companion

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    Actually your job does owe you compensation for parking in my opinion. But I am a visionary, maybe. Basically, when in doubt, think what does Scandinavia do?
     
  11. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    Not impossible. Young professionals (not just teachers) are finding ways to do it all over the country, abat.
    You can:
    Defer student loans
    Get a room mate
    Live at home with parents for a year or two
    Take a second job (many many teachers work second jobs even as seasoned teachers)
    Shop wisely (low priced/lw interest car, shop sales for groceries,etc)
     
  12. geoteacher

    geoteacher Devotee

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    With a certification in the area of social studies, I wouldn't think that you have a lot of leverage with regard to negotiation - and I say that as a social studies teacher. Generally speaking, commuting distance isn't a good reason to negotiate. After all, you are always free to move closer. When my salary was set, it was at a meeting with the superintendent where we discussed my years of experience.
     
  13. rookieteacher:)

    rookieteacher:) Companion

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    Almost every new graduate out of college (regardless of major) has to do the things above. I've been out four years and planning a wedding that requires expenses so I am still budgeting my paychecks.

    Realize you should be happy you have that salary!!! I had to sub for two years where I could earn $500 a week or I could earn $100 depending on the needs of the schools. It wasn't that I was a bad teacher but that I had to network and gain experience. (That and I knew I would be moving to another state)
     
  14. bandnerdtx

    bandnerdtx Aficionado

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    Negotiating a salary in the state of Texas is unheard of... Each district releases a salary schedule based on years experience and level of education, and that's it. Their are additional stipends for coaching, team leading/department chair, etc., but that's it.
     
  15. giraffe326

    giraffe326 Virtuoso

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    I taught in North Carolina for 6 years, and my salary when leaving was just under $31K. 6 YEARS. I owned my own house with a payment of nearly $900. No roommates. Granted, that leaves little wiggle room. A few costly repairs put me in credit card debt, which meant I had to work a second job to make ends meet.
    However, if I had stayed in my apartment (and it was $800 a month), I would have been fine financially. I wouldn't have been able to afford 'extras', but I could have made it financially. With my student loan debt and car payment.
     
  16. teacherintexas

    teacherintexas Maven

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    I looked at your list of started threads. They hadn't given you much advice on what to do in the job search process it seems. I wouldn't go by what they've said with all the gaps they left you with. It sounds as if they just left you to the wolves. It's good you have this forum to ask questions.
     
  17. dgpiaffeteach

    dgpiaffeteach Aficionado

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    There is no negotiating here. Salary is set by our union negotiated contract. I have one of the longest commutes but that is my CHOICE. I could choose to move closer but I prefer where I live. The district doesn't owe me anything for my choice. If they mandated where I lived, that would be a different story.

    My first year of teaching in 2014 I made $24k.
     
  18. karebear76

    karebear76 Habitué

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    :agreed:

    My first year of teaching was 2000, and I made $21K. Living on my own, paying all of my own expenses. I thankfully had no student loan debt, and I lived in a town with low housing expenses. The following year I transferred to another district and made $28K, but with a 37 mile one way commute. I also moved so my housing expense increased. My choice, my burden. I've remained at that district and my pay is almost at top of the scale. Our salary is union negotiated, board approved, with very little room for movement. You are paid based on your education and experience. End of story.

    Be thankful you have a job, and look for ways to cut expenses. You've been given several good examples in this thread.
     
  19. swansong1

    swansong1 Virtuoso

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    You don't negotiate a salary. If you can't live on the district pay scale, you get a part time job to supplement.

    Just for conversation...everyone thinks they are in the top 10%.
     
  20. Mrs. Rader

    Mrs. Rader Rookie

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    I have never heard of a teacher candidate negotiating salary in my area. The way salary is determined in the state of Kentucky is by your Rank (III is the base salary, everyone starts here). You can only go up in Rank with higher certification such as a Master's degree.

    That being said - starting salary for a Rank III in my surrounding districts is anywhere from $29K- $36K. Yes, it varies that much by district. I took a job for additional experience at a private school, my yearly salary is no where near that. Any living expenses my spouse and I have are still our responsibility, regardless of my commute or student loans. Kentucky seems to be very forgiving with various loan deferral programs and forgiveness opportunities. My commute could be anywhere from 50 miles up to 80. In my opinion, it would be worth the added expense to have the added income. :)

    I don't believe S.S. teachers around here are undervalued, I just think there are fewer openings for that subject area. My cousin recently lost his eligibility status because he was unable to find employment within the 6 year time frame we are given for our SOE. His field was high school S.S. :/
     
  21. blauren

    blauren Rookie

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    I've never heard of anyone being able to negotiate salary. I think at most schools, teachers unions negotiate the salary. Try to search for the school district's name and teacher salary schedule. That's how I've been able to find out what different districts pay.
     
  22. Jerseygirlteach

    Jerseygirlteach Groupie

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    In my district, salary is only negotiable in terms of what step you'll begin at. So, you might come to the table with 8 years of experience, but they might negotiate you down to Step 3. Lol. You're not getting anything extra just because they perceive you is a very qualified candidate, though. Budgets are too tight and competition is too fierce for something like that.
     
  23. Bunnie

    Bunnie Devotee

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    I'm going to be pretty blunt here. Based on your previous threads you are searching far and wide for a SS position. This goes to show you that there's fierce competition for so few jobs. 99% of the time you can not negotiate your salary and definitely not for the reasons you listed. Nobody came into teaching to make money.

    It's simple if the job offered has a salary that you feel is too little then decline the offer. However if you are applying to jobs in places where every school has a starting salary of 30K and you hope that you can negotiate because you feel you are in the top 10% or because your commute is long you are seriously kidding yourself. Every one starts at the bottom and has to work their way up.

    On a side note some schools may offer a relocation allowance, however that is seen as rare.

    Also I'm not sure where you are located but sometimes a P may not hire you because you live far and have a long commute. Here in NYC there are principals that won't hire teachers who live out in LI because when it snows those are the first teachers to call out, and this winter it snowed a lot. The average commute time is about 60-90 mins for teachers live that far so Ps take that into consideration.
     
  24. Pi-R-Squared

    Pi-R-Squared Groupie

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    If and when you get an offer that you feel does not compensate your worth, go ahead and negotiate and then let us know how it turns out. In fact, when you land an interview, tell them you're a top 10% candidate!

    You know I'm kidding, right?

    :D
     
  25. joeboo22

    joeboo22 Rookie

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    Every place is different so I'm not going to say you can't negotiate your salary. In most districts I've seen its a set step system, especially for the 1st 5 or so years. The only time I've seen negotiating is in CTE subjects or a teacher who has college experience.

    Now to find out what your benefits are, I'd just email HR, say hey can I get a copy of the salary and benefits plan.
     
  26. LMichele

    LMichele Cohort

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    This is not the case for myself and many of my friends that live on LI and commute to NYC for work. We made it in every single snow day, when many of the teachers who called out lived much closer to the school. This never came up as a negative for any LI candidates on the hiring committees that I served on this year.
     
  27. abat_jour

    abat_jour Companion

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    Great insights. In response to some of your posts; can't live with parents as they aren't alive, I do live cheaply - I own no furniture, sleep on an army surplus cot and eat eggs and chickpeas from a can. I have 1 week of work clothes, spend no money on going out or drinking, can't live closer to the school because there isn't property available to rent, I grew up picking up cans and dumpster driving...so you are talking to someone who lives more frugally than most people. Just because your first year you made a low salary doesn't mean everyone should and that it is okay. It is like saying "I was abused as a child and I lived through it so everyone should." We should working together to improve the working conditions in education. Hence Scandinavia being a model to look towards.

    If you read my first post, I was advised to negotiate salary by a career services person who specializes in the education sector - I didn't make it up.
     
  28. swansong1

    swansong1 Virtuoso

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    No one is saying you made it up...they are saying that the person who advised you to try to negotiate seems to be out of touch as far as teacher salaries in most districts.

    It sounds like you live pretty frugally, and it is a worthwhile goal to try to improve working conditions.

    However, at this point you need find a way to live by the district rules (ie...salary schedule). Once you have that job you could join the union and start working on your goals regarding work conditions.
     
  29. Bunnie

    Bunnie Devotee

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    That's good I hate when people are biased. I went on an interview years ago where the principal said they wouldn't hire anyone who lived too far like NJ or LI. I guess there were some issues at that school.
     
  30. Bunnie

    Bunnie Devotee

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    I would only negotiate a salary in a private or charter school. Maybe that's what your career services person meant. It's virtually impossible with public schools.

    I did negotiate my salary for the private school job I had. School was starting in a few days and they were in a bind. They were offering between 30-40k. I said I wouldn't accept an offer on the lower end. I got 37k. Til this day my former coworkers have no idea how I wound up getting paid that much. Everyone else made 30k or less. And "supposedly" my principal only made 40k so that was rather interesting.
     
  31. Mrs. Rader

    Mrs. Rader Rookie

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    In today's job market, most candidates end up taking a less than ideal position because they need both the experience and a decent level of income. Both of which are great. What I would do in your situation is calculate how much $$$ I would need to pay for weekly gas expenses, and compare that to how much I would make at the base salary rate of the school I was interested in. Would it be worth the drive after I paid for gas, parking, etc. ? If the answer is no, I would look elsewhere. Negotiating your salary in a public system is very rare, sadly. :( I do hope working conditions improve. I also hope you find a position where you believe you CAN negotiate salary. That would be lovely.

    In my local job market, I would be concerned that I would be looked over as a candidate if I tried to over sale myself and my abilities as a candidate. If two people are interviewed with equal qualifications, but one candidate wants X amount of dollars for his salary, versus the other candidate who wants Y amount. They will more than likely choose the candidate who is willing to work for the least amount of income. Sad, but with some states cutting more and more budgets this may be a more likely scenario now days.
     
  32. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    To cry, cry me a river
    Cry me a river-er
    Cry me a river
    Cry me a river-er, yea yea

    You didn't have any idea what teaching salaries were like? That most teachers make little money that is not commensurate with their education? What starting salaries are? Seriously?

    I'm so sorry for your struggles. Many have struggles. You're not alone...know that. But pull yourself up.... Rise above...prove yourself.

    You seem somewhat unprepared for what's out there....you've received help, support and advice on cover letters, portfolios, applications, emails, interviewing, salary placement...there are others in the top 10% who navigate all of this with ease. Find ways to stand out. To get beyond your background. To shine. To stand out. To be the compelling candidate.

    Good luck to you.
     
  33. dgpiaffeteach

    dgpiaffeteach Aficionado

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    You could also look at areas where the cost of living is cheaper if you can move. My district starts out at about $33k and you can get a two bedroom apartment 15-20 minutes away for $600.
     
  34. kpa1b2

    kpa1b2 Aficionado

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    I know that I have lost out on jobs because when I was asked what my salary requirement was, it was more then the school was willing to pay.
     
  35. kaeco510

    kaeco510 Companion

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    I have never heard of being able to negotiate salary beyond negotiating years of experience.

    I spoke to the HR director in my previous district and she told me "You are starting on step 2 and your pay will be xx". There was no negotiating, nor did I think there would be.

    There are always places to rent! I moved my entire life from one state to another to take my previous job. I "couldn't afford" to do so either, but I did what I had to do to make the job work. I struggled to make ends meet all year. I have school loans, credit card debt (from the move), had to get a new car as my old one died, etc. I did not go into teaching for the money and knew it would be a struggle.
     
  36. OhThePlaces

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    I have never heard of negotiating salary for public school positions. I understand the struggle of starting off with a minuscule salary, but I'm assuming you expected that when you chose a teaching career.

    I'm also curious about what places you in the top 10% of candidates? Didn't you post a little while back concerned about your low GPA?
     
  37. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    :rolleyes: yeah, there's that...
     
  38. Preschool0929

    Preschool0929 Cohort

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    I don't have anything to say that everyone hasn't already said, but there is no negotiation in my state. There is a pay scale, rank by education and experience. End of story. However, pay scales differ by district. I teach in the best paying district in my state. With a masters and 0 experience, my starting salary was $43,000/year. Is is possible for you to look into different districts that might have a higher pay scale? The only way to make more than your given salary would be to take on extra duties, like coaching a team, which gives you an extra stipend.
     
  39. FaithDriven

    FaithDriven Rookie

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    I was going to suggest something along the lines of what Preschool said. I am in CA and just got offered a position in West Texas. I am also a first year teacher. I've checked out many districts all over the state and the majority had a pay scale posted. However, there is a drastic different in these pay scales depending on the district. I've seen areas that start at 28K. The district that I got hired at starts at 44k, and 49k with a masters degree. They also offer many other incentives (sign on bonuses, help with housing, etc.) to get people out there because it is a rural area. There are many other big districts out there that start around the same. It may be something you want to check out.
     
  40. RainStorm

    RainStorm Phenom

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    Jul 9, 2014

    If you are talking about a public school, there is a defined salary scale that they go by. They don't deviate. The same is true of many private schools, but not all.

    For public schools, the defined salary scale is generally printed on the HR dept for schools web page.

    There is no real negiotiation with public schools. There may or may not with private schools, but I certainly wouldn't count on it.

    They do not care what your expenses are, they offer a job at a set salary schedule. As for being in the "top 10%" I hope you realize that you are competing against people with years of experience, tons of initiative, Master's degrees, 4.0 GPA's, and multiple endorsements, etc. They are willing to work for the salary stated in the pay scale. If you aren't, they'll just choose one of them.

    Good luck in finding a job. We were all new at some point or another.
     

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