Generation of Rude Kids?

Discussion in 'General Education' started by soleil00, Dec 7, 2011.

  1. soleil00

    soleil00 Comrade

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    Dec 7, 2011

    It seems to be that way according to my coworkers.

    Today was my worst day on record. I have 21 kids and I sent home notes with 14 of them for their behavior. I'm at my wits end with them. They won't stop talking and no punishment is working. I am limited in what I can do. I've sent notes home, I've sent them out of the room to our "behavior specialist" but I'm not allowed to send more than 2 kids to her unless it's like a 5 kid fight, and I can send them to the counselor but that's like a 30 minute waste of time because they don't care.

    I really have nothing I can do to punish them other than parent contact. Nothing else phases them and the fact that most of my parents never call me back or sign the notes tells me that probably isn't working either.

    I tell them to do something, they turn around and do what they want. I tell them to stop talking, they stop for 10 seconds and then keep on going like I'm an idiot. I have 5 kids that are failing because they are flat out refusing to do homework, AR, or a lot of our lessons. They're turning in shoddy half-completed work and won't fix it if I point it out.

    I would feel worse except all my veteran colleagues say their classes are doing it too so it must be a "generational thing" that the kids are rude and disrespectful.

    I had two girls get in trouble at recess (we were inside watching a movie due to the cold temp) and they were put "on the wall". They looked at the coach that got onto them and continued doing what they were doing. She had to put them on complete opposite sides of the room and they moved themselves back next to each other to talk.

    This is really more of a vent than anything but I would love to know if you can help me. I had a nervous breakdown today. I cried when I got home.


    Edit:
    I've been debating trying a reward system for those that are behaving properly instead of just constantly griping at the ones behaving negatively but I'm not sure how to go about that. It's a constant roller coaster of behavior. One minute Little Susie is an angel, the next minute she's screaming at her neighbor. I never have a consistently good day for any one kid.
     
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  3. tgim

    tgim Habitué

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    Three ideas:
    1. Catch 'em being good (even if only one or two for first few times); play it up BIG time. Send home GOOD notes with a couple of them.
    2. Do not teach or talk while they are talking. I carry a timer and they hear the beep when I click it on and they shhhsh each other because they know I take the timer time off of recess if they use our learning time for talking.
    3. Run, do not walk, to the Whole Brain Teacing (wbt) board on here for some excellent ideas for classroom management.
     
  4. soleil00

    soleil00 Comrade

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    See... the problem is they don't care about losing recess time. They completely lost recess every day this week due to their rudeness towards the cafeteria ladies. Only one out of 21 wasn't sitting out recess. They've flat out told me they don't care if they have recess or not, "they're going to play when they get home anyway, so what does it matter".

    They were perfectly fine up until November. Ever since the first of November they've been acting like they've never been to school before.
     
  5. teacherintexas

    teacherintexas Maven

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    If they have shut down, go back to the "first of school" mode. I teach in a school with a very similar population. We have what my friend would call "Come to Jesus" meetings quite often.

    I have had 37% complete homework. So those 37% of the kids didn't have homework the next week, and got to play board games while the other kids started on their homework in class. The week I did that, the percentage went up to 86%. It's not a cure-all, but it helped.
     
  6. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    People who criticize today's generation of young people forget who raised it.
     
  7. waterfall

    waterfall Maven

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    Haha, my co-op teacher in student teaching used to say "come to Jesus meeting/talk" all the time. That just reminded me of her:).

    To the OP, we have the same problem at my school with kids not caring if they miss recess. I only really have one group of kids that's a behavior problem, and when I tried saying things like, "if now is not a good time for you to get this work done, you can come do it at recess" they would literally say, "Yeah! Can I? I would rather do it later." My suggestiong is to find out wha they DO care about missing. Like others have suggested, that may mean creating a reward for those who are behaving (a really fun activity of some sort) and having the other students sitting at their desks watching or doing work.
     
  8. Aliceacc

    Aliceacc Multitudinous

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    Dec 8, 2011

    For every single kid I've ever met who was rude or spoiled I've met a dozen who were total delights, ready willing and able to go the extra mile to help.

    Sorry, I don't buy your generalization.
     
  9. tgim

    tgim Habitué

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    Agree, Alice. I think OP is just very frustrated; if they were fine up until Nov., it can't be a generational thing.

    I also agree with going back to basics -AND planning fun activity that few who do follow rules can do....
    ...and pray that once the holidays pass, they will settle back into the routine they have been trained to follow. :blush:
     
  10. Cerek

    Cerek Aficionado

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    Dec 8, 2011

    When I first began subbing 3 years ago, I also thought kids today were more rude (in general) than those of my generation. However, after doing my student teaching and having the same kids for an extended time (rather than 1-2 days at a time as a sub), I freely admit I was completely wrong. MOST kids today ARE still respectful of their teachers and other adults in general. I do feel the ones that choose to be rude are far more rude and disrespectful than the "bad kids" from my classes in school. I've had kids do and say things in my room that even the worst classmate from my time would never have considered doing. That being said, I completely agree with Alice and Caesar both; I avoid broad generalizations and any criticism of one generation must also reflect on the previous generation, since they are the ones that raised them.

    For the specifics in the OP - I'm very sorry you are having such a difficult time with your class. I can only imagine how overwhelming it must be to have 2/3 of the class acting up during the day - especially at that age. But I also have to shake my head at some of the things that are going on.

    First of all, why have your kids decided they have a choice about doing their work or not? I had some problems with that myself last year (teaching 6th), until I realized the root of the problem was that the kids felt they DID have a choice of doing their work or just taking a "0". So I started writing names on the board with the missing assignments and told them they WOULD complete those assignments - PERIOD! Not doing the assignments was not an option. In my case, I did make the kids stay in from recess to do the missing assignments. After missing recess a couple of times, they decided it was better to turn their homework in on time.

    I'm also completely baffled at the two girls who were put "on the wall" and simply moved their chairs back to be with each other. Again, WHO SAID THEY HAD THE CHOICE TO DO THAT???? I would have not only moved them back, but placed their seats in opposite corners facing the wall. If they tried moving them again, I would physically move them back to the corner AND give them a short writing assignment on Respect when we got back to the room (for first grade, that could be as short 3-4 sentences).

    You also said the kids had been fine until November, so I agree with the PP who said it's time to go back to "start of school" mode. I know the "old style" of teaching is sometimes frowned upon and we want our lessons to be fun and enriching, but there is nothing wrong with cracking down, making kids stay in their seats and giving them enough work to keep them busy from bell to bell. And there is nothing wrong with letting them know there will NOT be any "fun time" at all until their behavior and level of respect improve dramatically.

    Kids NEED structure and discipline and it sounds like your kiddos aren't getting this at home, so they don't think they have to follow it at school. If they are this out of control, you need to let them know their behavior will NOT be tolerated in your room.

    I also fully recommend the Whole Brain Teaching techniques, especially for this age. I think it could really help you turn them back into the Little Angels they were before.

    Good luck. Let us know what adjustments you make and how they work for you.
     
  11. isabunny

    isabunny Comrade

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    Dec 8, 2011

    Do you use a positive behavior chart system or any other positive behavior reinforcement. I worked in a similar Kindergarten Class as you are describing. It works well to use a group and an individual positive reinforcers. I have used a card system I bought at one of the teacher supply stores. You use a space on the wall to put up envelops. In each envelope is a group of cards (green, yellow, red) and they have happy or sad faces. As the students display unwanted behaviors they have to go turn their cards. Anyone on red gets a note home. I used to give the students rewards if all the cards were still on green at the end of the day (extra recess, a short movie at the end of the week, lunch with the teacher, pencils, homework passes, little candies, ect...). I also used the tried and true marbles in the jar. Let the kids decide what they will get for filling up the jar (movie, ice pops, chips, no homework for a week, ect...). When the students all were on task I would say, "You all have had your listening ears on really well. Thanks! I am going to put three marbles in your jar!" They received most marbles for walking quietly down the halls. I would hold up five fingers as we walked and if students were misbehaving I would put down one finger, then another, ect.... If someone walked by and told us how quiet they were I would double the marbles they got. Those positive "games" really work at the young ages!
     
  12. Pacificpastime

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    Dec 8, 2011

    I agree with one of the pps on finding something that they do care about. This may be different for each kids, but each kid cares about something. You just have to find out what that thing is and take advantage of it.
     
  13. Enseignante<3

    Enseignante<3 Companion

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    Even though you don't have consistent good behavior from any of them, you need to reward that glimpse of it you see. When you reward them for doing something good, they are going to keep doing that good thing.

    I have a whole class positive reward system (we have a hundred chart on the board and the class chose the reward they are working for - when the whole class is on task, I fill in some blocks. When they fill it up, they get the reward.) Ok, so they aren't good whole class - if they are quiet and working for even just 2 minutes, fill in a block - they'll eventually get it and start doing more.

    For individuals I use tickets - I hand out tickets when a student is especially on-task/good/kind to others. They put them in a bucket and every Friday I draw out 3 names to get rewards.

    For poor behavior, I use a silent warning, then loss of privilege, then phone call home. For loss of privilege it is recess or the don't get to participate in something fun the class is doing. I have 4th graders and they don't like losing recess, so that's why I use that. I agree with some other posters that said to find something they DO like and take away that.

    I am by no means a management expert, but this works for me. I have a class that was really tough to start with - LOTS of talking and a few nudges that are on individual behavior plans now for some very disrespectful behaviors. But its gotten so much better with these things!

    I hope you can figure out what works for you :)
     
  14. greendream

    greendream Cohort

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    How does this reply help the original poster in any way?

    As for the topic at hand, I second the suggestion to tighten the reins. In my experience, once the "fear" factor of a new classroom wears off, once they get comfortable with you as a teacher, they think they can get away with more. If I see this happening, I find ways to remind them that I'm the one in charge, and that they can't get away with misbehavior just because we know each other better than we did on the first day.
     
  15. knitter63

    knitter63 Groupie

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    Dec 8, 2011

    :thumb::yeahthat:
     
  16. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    I think it's worth keeping in mind that if we're going to make sweeping generalizations about a huge group of kids, we need to be mindful of certain facts, primarily that OUR generation plays some role in the behaviors of the younger generations. Perhaps my comments weren't as practical as the the other advice and calls to action here, but I think they are valid nonetheless. I don't find it helpful to be critical without reason or to dismiss an entire group of kids by saying, Oh well, they're just rude/bad/whatever.
     
  17. Reality Check

    Reality Check Habitué

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    "Generation of Rude Kids?" I agree.

    For those who run and hide under their desks when they read those "generalizations," specifically, I'll say that the percentage is higher of rude kids than it has been in years past. (I didn't think we were in a court of law and had be write like lawyers on a message board, but I'll placate those who get all in a twist about it.)

    Sometimes these "classroom management" gimmicks work for a short term, most times they don't. If your school administration doesn't enforce any sort of discipline and keeps laying it all back on you, you're sunk no matter what steps you take.


    :dunno:
     
  18. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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  19. Reality Check

    Reality Check Habitué

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    You can count on at least one staff development speaker try to get cute and throw some quote from Socrates complaining about the youth of his era. Then the speaker, thinking that they are clever, but unknowingly making a jacka*s out of themselves, tries to embarrass the teachers in attendance by essentially saying, "See? Kids haven't changed since Socrates' time! They behave just as they did in 400 B.C.!"

    I'm sure they don't realize how asinine they sound. We've lowered the standards of behavior and STILL the percentage of ill-mannered students goes up.
     
  20. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    I'm sure you aren't implying that my post was asinine. Now THAT would be rude.:eek:

    And again I'm left wondering:


    I would hope that teachers' negative feelings about 'kids these days' doesn't affect students' learning opportunities.
     
  21. greendream

    greendream Cohort

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    Let's assume that it's true that kids are rude and it's because of the generation who raised them. So what? Just because they have an excuse doesn't mean that behavior is acceptable. Why not give advice to deal with the problem rather than throwing out a useless one-liner?
     
  22. czacza

    czacza Multitudinous

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    I'm not quite sure why you are continuing to downgrade Caesar's replies. Caesar is not accepting bad behaviors and I'd bet she doesn't tolerate rudeness from her students. Not only is student rudeness unacceptable, but so is the disdain some educators seem to convey when generalizing about the students they teach.:2cents:
     
  23. YoungTeacherGuy

    YoungTeacherGuy Phenom

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    I agree that the previous one-liner wasn't helpful at all.

    Anyway, I serve about 180 kids each day. Overall, they're really good kids. I do, however, have one period (5th period) that's awful. The mix of kids in that particular class is horrible. It's sad, too, because out of a class of 30 kids, 25 are great and only 5 are a nightmare.

    Just a side note: The five students I'm referring to are mainstreamed from an "Opportunity Class." In my district, "Opportunity Class" is a self-contained class in which students who have extreme issues with poor behavior and failing grades are housed. Somehow, five of the ten kids in that class ended up with me during 5th period! :dizzy:
     
  24. YoungTeacherGuy

    YoungTeacherGuy Phenom

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    To answer the original question, though, here's what I did with my 2nd graders in the past:

    I'd recognize and reward good behavior. For example, "WOW! I just LOVE how Suzie is sitting like a smart 2nd grader! Here's a sticker, Suzie!" Or, "Take a look, boys and girls! I can tell Group #4 is ready to learn! I'm giving Group #4 a point for their team right now!"

    At the end of the week, the group/team with the most points would get a special treat.
     
  25. Loomistrout

    Loomistrout Devotee

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    Hmm... there are many teachers who don't need administration to do discipline for them. For these teachers it is largely a result of the management steps they have taken which nips rudeness in the bud and, although not perfect, a rude moment in their class is a rare event. In addition, a hallmark of effective classroom management is the lack of administration involvement whereas an attribute of ineffective management is reliance on administration to solve the teacher's problems.
     
  26. Enseignante<3

    Enseignante<3 Companion

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    Just a comment on the "who raised them" issue -

    Our OP, like me, sounds to be a 1st year or very early career teacher, probably pretty young and doesn't have kids. I certainly had very little hand in raising any children of this generation, so I doubt the OP did either, if my assumptions are true.

    Just me two cents :)
     
  27. Cerek

    Cerek Aficionado

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    Caesar's point was this: If you're going to make a sweeping generalization about the current generation, then you also have to accept a sweeping generalization that the previous generation must take some of the blame for how the current generation turned out.

    If you don't like being swept into that generalization, then you can understand the kids of this generation don't either.

    It is extremely unfair to make broad generalizations about any group, but I personally disagree that this generation is any more rude than the previous ones. A few kids or even an entire class of kids is NOT a large enough sample size to characterize ALL kids of a generation.

    Add to that the fact that the OP's subsequent posts admitted the kids had not been "bad" until the first of November and her own words contradict the generalization she made in the title.
     
  28. stephenpe

    stephenpe Connoisseur

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    Sometimes teachers are like the blind men describing the
    elephant. Some work in "hell" and some work in the garden
    of eden. I work in utopia fwiw.
     
  29. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    Thank you. That was exactly my point.
     
  30. bandnerdtx

    bandnerdtx Aficionado

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    Dec 9, 2011

    I've worked in an inner city "gangsta" school, and I've worked in the heart of suburbia, and what I've learned is that kids are people, too. Just like there are adults that can be mean, selfish and stubborn, there are kids that can be, too. However, I think the vast majority of people (kids included) are good and choose to do the right thing and behave in socially acceptable ways. We just seem to only think about the "jerks" when we go home (adult or child).
     
  31. soleil00

    soleil00 Comrade

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    I'm sorry, I'm trying to catch up I haven't been able to get on at all lately!

    To address the "generation" comment: That was made by my veteran colleague of 59 years in the profession. She says this is by far the worst group of kids overall in her 59 years. I meant to put it in quotes, but forgot. I don't know if I believe it, since I haven't been around any other generation before. I am 23, I don't have kids and I live by myself. I really have no opinion on whether this generation is "worse than previous ones" or not but I know for a fact they are extremely rude for no reason and expect nothing to come of it.

    I'm unsure who posted it but I remember seeing a PP about why the students think they have a "choice" with their papers. Mainly because my administration (Superintendent not P.. she hates it) prefers us not to FORCE them to do anything because he thinks first graders are capable of making intelligent choices on their own...haha. So we give them consequences and call it good. IF they don't do homework? That's their choice, but they get a 0 for the completion grade. If they choose not to complete an assignment? Whatever but their grade reflects it.

    Right now they have stuff to work towards with it being the holidays we have parties week after next. Their attendance of the parties is solely dependent on their behavior.

    I think they started taking me for granted because I had it today with them and took the AR prizes away from three kids who were fighting over them. The others looked at me like "oh crap... she's serious now" and were near perfect the rest of the day. They know I don't like to be angry or mean with them so when I get that way they immediately stop. We actually got a lot accomplished today. Nearly all, if not all, of our tests were done without a shred of complaining..

    My main issue isn't they are rude to me, they aren't. They know better than that. My issue is they are rude to each other and have gotten into this frame of mind that they don't have to listen to a teacher that isn't me.

    My Co-op teacher says hers are doing the same thing, which I've noticed because they ignore me and my kids ignore her if she corrects their behavior in the hall or somewhere outside the classroom.

    It's almost as if outside the classroom, the rules don't exist when I'm not around. The only outside teachers they listen to are the art teacher, music teacher, coaches and library aide.

    We're going to have a big talk on Monday about that because I've been approached by too many teachers saying so and so completely ignored them when they told so and so to stop running in the hall (or something like that).

    I'm also going to start thinking tonight on different reward systems for positive behaviors. I can't continue to focus on the negative because it is making ME negative!
     

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