Do You Know a Second or Third Language?

Discussion in 'Teacher Time Out' started by Master Pre-K, Aug 11, 2008.

  1. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Aug 12, 2008

    well if I had my choice to learn other Language it would be Latin and American Sign Language both are related to the history of Language.

    terptoteacher Have you ever seen Larry The cable guy's routine of a
    Sign Language user that has Tourettes? One of my friends who is Hearing & Speech impaired says it is the funniest thing he has ever seen.
     
  2. Jem

    Jem Aficionado

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    Bottom line: yes, teachers should know another language. It is terrible when you can't communicate with parents (my principal had to translate at my parent/teacher conferences, and I could never trust what he was saying). You should be setting an example for your students by stretching out of a comfort zone. Knowing the roots of words gives you a better grasp of your own language and gives you a solid base with which to teach grammar and writing.

    But.... it is so, so hard to learn if you were not taught as a child. Like, elementary child. So maybe we need to move forward and start pushing for this in our schools? Because we see how difficult it is getting to live in a world with a second language? Kind of like we push for computers and technology? It's a global world, and we are the ones that need to be the advocates for our kids.

    I think I'll work on this this year for our school.
     
  3. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    I had the scary experience of having to go to the hospital with one of my little guys a few years back and it took 3 HOURS to get a translator in Spanish in Inner City Chicago! I couldn't believe it!
     
  4. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    Here - just knowing spanish won't help you. One of the girls in my graduate class last semester teachers preschool and has 10 languages in her room - none are Spanish.

    These are the stats of kids who were considered ELL last year in CPS- Keep in mind we have MANY KIDS who don't qualify for ELL, but who have parents who do not know/understand English.

    http://www.olce.org/pdfs/OLCE At A Glance - February 2008.pdf

    (The stats are out of order because the way it copied... Polish should follow Spanish- not Urdu- but if you look - you can figure it out).

    Spanish 43,482
    Urdu 596
    Assyrian 146
    Polish 1,444
    Vietnamese 384
    French 142
    Cantonese 895
    Pilipino 349
    Ukrainian 142
    Arabic 699
    Bosnian/Serbian 296
    Gujarati 141

    At any rate- many of the schools that have multiple languages in certain areas- where knowing Spanish could be helpful- but certainly won't be the know all when communicating with families.
     
  5. each1teach1

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    muchachos are your older kids (boys/ mixed group), niños are your little kids but can be used with affection to address older kids (such as a parent calling her 17 year old son her baby even though he's clearly not a baby).

    -os vs. -as is just one of the things about the language that you guys have to accept. It used to tick me off too. But it's kind of how we'll say "Ok guys, you need to settle down" even though the group is mixed gender.

    venga aqui is used for adults or superiors such as your boss even if they're younger. You need the command form of ven aqui when talking to young children.

    almuerzo means lunch. Lonche is spanglish. However, sometimes in Mexico, almuerzo is used for breakfast instead of Desayuno and Comida is used for lunch although comida technically just means food.

    Carro is a real word, but is sometimes replaced by coche, both meaning car.

    Limon means lime. The word for lime is escaping me right now.

    But yeah, Spanish can be confusing.
     
  6. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Aug 13, 2008

    Thank you Jem!!!!!:thanks::agreed::clap::clap::clap:
     
  7. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Aug 13, 2008

    :agreed: :clap::clap:

    Consistency is vital in communication.

    Nowhere is this more important than Early Childhood Education.

    I feel that I can't win for losing. I have children who don't understand me, and I must learn a new language to understand them.
     
  8. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    So, I would propose that every school that has students who have a 2nd language, provide funding and resources for their teachers to learn the home language.
     
  9. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    So what do you propose happens in the schools where 10 or so languages are spoken and who is to pay for this? It sounds wonderful in an ideal situation- but how will the funding happen?

    I just took an entire summer course on BIL Ed. I think I came out with more questions than I went in with- There is not much research out there that says what is the best way to teach language either- which complicates matters.
     
  10. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Aug 13, 2008

    Just in case you were wondering...

    This is a real ad that put me on my soapbox!

    Lutheran Social Services of Illinois (LSSI) is seeking a full-time qualified candidate to oversee Pre-School for All services in Head Start classrooms for three to five year old children and complete required paperwork. Ability to read, write, and speak Yoribu, Igbo, Ege, Ewe, Wolof, or French a plus! Must pass pre-employment drug screen and background check. Due to ISBE requirements, candidate must have a Bachelor`s degree in Early Childhood Education and a Type 04 Early Childhood Certification. Two years of teaching three to five year old children required. We offer an excellent benefit package including retirement, paid vacation, ten paid holidays a year and insurance. EOE

    Now, you tell me, what was your first, gut reaction? :huh:

    Needless to say, I meet ALL the other qualifications!

    And yes, I see it says the ability to use these languages is a plus, not a requirement. But...this is a very important factor.

    Last but not least... notice the initials at the end of the ad?

    Equal Opportunity Employer

    There was nothing equal about my education. So I can't have an equal chance of being employed.

    That is my point.

    Thanks to everyone for your comments. And a big thanks to those of you who see and share my pain.
     
  11. New3rdTeacher

    New3rdTeacher Comrade

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    Aug 13, 2008

    I speak Arabic and English :)
     
  12. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    Honestly? My first reaction was "Is this in Uptown?"

    Then say-- think how many people around have the qualifications and speak one of those languages.
    I'm pretty sure this would have to be in Uptown (because that is the most diverse 'hood in the city and one where many refugees go initially) and they don't have a "grow your own" program that I know of. They also have A TON of EC schools/centers. CPS ones, Christopher House etc. So if they have someone qualified- those people may be already employed elsewhere. So apply. Show your willingness to learn 3-5 sentences in the language. Now if it were Spanish- someone would probably interview you in both languages- I bet these centers need someone to speak those languages and have yet to find it - so they have nothing to lose by printing that in the add. However, they may not have an interview in one of those languages because no one speaks it. So just apply and then say you are willing to learn basic phrases.
     
  13. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    You know if you take the entire 4-6 course series, you will have the Sp.Ed/BIL Endorsement. That's good. But what happens when the demographics in your school changes, and you get a whole new ethnic group?! Will you back for a 3rd language?! I think that's when the schools should step in, and make some type of accommodations for us.

    I don't know.. but I hope one day it happens...L.A. is a perfect example. When I took my DL exam there, they had at least 15 different languages available for the written test, AND interpreters available for the road test too!

    Just look at the Olympics! All those people out there, speaking different languages!!! They always use ONLY three languages, one being the host nation. This is what Mayor Daley needs to start thinking about! We need more programs in place to work more with those who speak a different language, but first help the teachers work with students who speak a different langugage!
     
  14. CanadianTeacher

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    Not only funding, but realistically, especially in preschool, kids will soak up everything and pick up different languages like sponges. So teach them your language instead of struggling with learning all of theirs. They will benefit much more from learning English than you would from learning key phrases in 10 other languages every other year and they'll do it much more easily. As for communicating with parents, IMO either they learn to function in the country they are in or they find an interpreter. Sounds harsh, but...
     
  15. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Head Start does not feel that way

    Unfortunately CT, Head Start does not feel that way....

    More specifically, the Program Performance Standards require that programs:

    provide an environment of acceptance that supports and respects gender, culture, language, ethnicity, and family composition;
    serve foods that reflect cultural and ethnic preferences;
    communicate with families in their preferred or primary language or through an interpreter, to the extent feasible;
    hire staff, whenever possible, who speak the home languages of infants and toddlers, and when a majority of children speak the same language, hire at least one classroom staff member or home visitor who speaks their language; and
    promote family participation in literacy-related activities in both English and the home languages.
    Other standards play important supportive roles in creating successful and responsive program services for all children, including ELLs and their families.


    Basically, this means every class must have one teacher or assistant that speaks the home language. All materials must be labeled in the room in both languages. Parents must have access to a staff member who speaks their languange. Directors, supervisors and teachers can talk around me all day, and I never know what they are talking about, until...a parent is upset...then EVERYONE is speaking English.

    And here's the part that really gets me!

    Teachers are expected to eat with the children, family style. In most cases, that is 4 meals a day! I had to serve myself food from other countries, and supposedly model proper behavior by eating what they eat?!

    I have allergies for one thing. But why should I have to eat food that I am not familiar with or don't eat on a regular basis?

    They won't find any of that stuff in the lunchroom once they get to kindergarten!

    And the staff expects the others to embrace their culture in the environment of the school. Celebrating their holidays, and eating their food for staff events. People think I am anti-social or just rude because I don't want to participate. I have a right to eat my own food. It causes too much tension, IMO. There is a fine line between celebrating multiculturalism, and respecting individual preferences.

    :2cents:
     
  16. CanadianTeacher

    CanadianTeacher Groupie

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    Wow! Just a little overboard?? So basically, you need to become a part of each of your students' cultures and abandon your own. In the effort to embrace multiculturalism, we find ourselves putting our own beliefs aside to accommodate others. Where does it end? If we were in one of those countries, would they do that for us? Probably not. I agree 100% with your final sentence "...fine line between celebrating muticulturalism and respecting individual preferences." and I think it's being crossed.
     
  17. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    If I took all the courses at my current school, which is 4 or so courses- I would come out with an ESL endorsement not a Bil endorsement. I don't speak another language. ESL is for all languages not just Spanish. At any rate- I opted not to take the ESL classes because I don't want 4 more classes right now and I am already Special Ed, not endorsed - but I have a Type 10 3 - 21 cert.
     
  18. terptoteacher

    terptoteacher Connoisseur

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    Aug 13, 2008


    Gonna check it out now!
     
  19. TemperanceFaith

    TemperanceFaith Comrade

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    I can understand Spanish and Italian very well, and used to be able to speak both, but I have not used either in a while so I would need to take a refresher course in both to be able to converse with someone. I can have a very basic conversation in either language, but I have no doubt my conjugation of verbs and past and present tense usage might not be correct.;)
     
  20. terptoteacher

    terptoteacher Connoisseur

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    I found the song about his deaf brother, but none about someone with tourettes. I did find a clip of a gong show like event from a group called deftourettes. That was funny--naughty, but funny!
     
  21. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    Aug 13, 2008

    Here you go MPK. It's state pre- so no food. It could be Hyde Park though- so there maybe many languages- but it doesn't say anything about that in the info.

    Harte School – Unit #3780
    1556 E. 56th Street
    Chicago, IL 60637 (or GSR #41)
    Telephone
    Fax
    (773) 535-0870
    (773) 535-0666
    Grade or Subject Pre-Kindergarten and Preschool
    Certificate Requirements Type 04
    Submit To Principal Mrs. Shenethe Parks
    Other information Preschool for All is an expansion of the State Prekindergarten
    Program that makes Illinois the first state in the nation to offer a
    high quality 2 ½ hour (A.M. and P.M.) preschool program for three
    and four year old children. The goal of the program is to ensure
    that all children are well prepared to succeed in school and in life.
    The candidate must possess the following:
    • the ability to motivate and engage students with a high
    quality early childhood curriculum.
    • knowledge and skills to implement a high-quality and
    successful early childhood education program
    Cont…
    46
    Other information • work collaboratively with teachers and parents to
    meet the needs of our students
    • excellent classroom management skills
    • be willing to participate in school activities/events which
    extend beyond the school day
    • communicate effectively within the school community
    • have outstanding attendance and punctuality
    All applicants must email an introductory letter outlining
    accomplishments and experiences related to the position and a
    copy of their resume to the principal at sparks @ cps.k12.il.us
     
  22. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Aug 13, 2008


    I agree, I am confused, and I am tired... :agreed::dunno::|
     
  23. Master Pre-K

    Master Pre-K Virtuoso

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    Aug 13, 2008

    THANK YOU TURTLE!!!!

    :thanks::hugs:
     
  24. corps2005

    corps2005 Cohort

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    Well, I used to be completely fluent in German, but after living here for so long and not really running into people that speak German, I'm much better at writing and reading. My speaking abilities have become rusty, but it bounces back as soon as I'm exposed to the language or listen to songs. (natural born German citizen-not military)

    I'm trying to become fluent in Spanish. It's the language my husband and his family speak and the primary language in which we will raise our child. I took courses up to the mid-3000 level in college. I transferred to Cobb now, and our school has sign-ups for Rosetta Stone, WOOT!!! And I signed up for a Spanish speaking course as well, so hopefully I'll reach fluent in the next year or so.

    The Spanish is definitely going to help because many of my parents speak Spanish and very little English. It will also help since we don't plan on speaking English at home with our children, unless necessary for homework.

    A foreign language was required in my undergrad program, but only two courses. In high school, we had to take 2 years of a language. I took French, and can only remember how to say "How are you?" :lol:

    For intellectual reasons, I do think one should know a second language. I simply enjoy learning. :p The question is which language should one learn? Sure, Spanish is very needed right now, but on the international front the Asian and Middle-Eastern languages seem to be becoming front runners.

    The problem about requiring teachers to know a second language is that the necessary language varies by region.
     
  25. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Putting on my old coot armer

    I have read some of Samuel Huntington Works;

    I would like to know what is America's core identity?

    Do we have Values planted here by America's original English speaking Protestant settlers - hard work, individualism, social reform, religiosity, and the rule of law?
    "Would America be the country it has been if it were settled by French, Spanish, or Portuguese Catholics?
     
  26. Carmen13

    Carmen13 Groupie

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    :rolleyes:...If it was settled by Portuguese Catholics, it would probably be like Brazil!:lol:
     
  27. CanadianTeacher

    CanadianTeacher Groupie

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    Don't know who Samuel Huntington is...

    I don't know what America's core identity is as I'm Canadian. All I know is that trying to adopt every other identity as you also try to do your job is a bit ridiculous. No one has to abandon their identity, but in a public situation there should be some general concensus for ease of operation.
     
  28. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    His latest book
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Are_We?_The_Challenges_to_America's_National_Identity
     
  29. CanadianTeacher

    CanadianTeacher Groupie

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    I'm sorry....I'm not quite sure what you are getting at with this :confused:

    I have no problem with multiculturalism at all. My argument is that for public purposes, everyone should be required to be able to communicate in one common language AND that people who do not have a particular ethnicity not be forced to take part in customs and beliefs that are not theirs. Even in Africa where there are many languages and dialects among the many countries, French is the official language of a lot of places. Most countries have an official language to avoid problems with communication.
     
  30. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    We Americans are loosing our identity in favor of multiculturalism.
    Multiculturalism is more important the being an American.
    It is Multiculturalism that is part of being an American
    not
    Being an American is part of Multiculturalism
     
  31. CanadianTeacher

    CanadianTeacher Groupie

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    So you are agreeing with my points?
     
  32. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Yes
     
  33. CanadianTeacher

    CanadianTeacher Groupie

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    Ohhh!!! I thought you were attacking my point of view and I wasn't sure what you were getting at (hence the 'tone' in my post the first time I replied to you :sorry:). Now it's clear--forgive me, sometimes I need thing spelled out to me... :lol: :blush:
     
  34. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Does that mean I can be Canadian? I played Hockey & Lacrosse
     
  35. CanadianTeacher

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    Sure! :cool:

    I'm interested in neither. My son plays football and I love to go to his games and practices. I guess that makes him a potential American?? ;) He says he'd like to play for a university in the States! He's only 13...we'll see where that leads. :mellow:
     
  36. Teachling

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    Interesting enough, one of the speakers in my new teacher training mentioned the list of her credentials which extended for K- high school & among concentrations, included Spanish. Well, according to her she is not FLUENT but she came from before the NCLB. The impression I got was that other than being in CA she had no association or background with the Spanish culture EVER. At that time school at risk school would hire anyone with a "Bachelors degree & a pulse" (paraphrasing her). I find this interesting because it took me years to make the decision to be a bilingual teacher because I was questioning my abilities. Don't get me wrong I am so nervous about being in the classrm but I see now that I should have been concentrating on my strengths & taken the challenges head on. I wasted so much time. Oh well, live & learn.

    Addressing should this be a requirement for new teachers --- look at places like Venezuela, Canada & China for examples as to what they are doing. From what I have heard countries like China & Venezuela are at minimum doing tri-lingual. Communication & language are important factors to staying on top & from studies & current events seems like US is falling short. I just don't understand what are we thinking? Are we narcizus (sp?)to think that are language is always going to rule the world? Don't mean to sound gloom but I just don't see the US being a 'Super' power for long. We are just not keeping up with the times.
     
  37. Zelda~*

    Zelda~* Devotee

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    Ah, if just one of our fore-fathers had voted differently, we'd all be speaking German right now. :D
    Interesting, yes?
     
  38. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    Remember our football fields are only 120 Yards long
    [​IMG]
    Canadian Football is 150 Yards long
    [​IMG]
    NOT TO SCALE
     
  39. Irishdave

    Irishdave Enthusiast

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    It is important to note that the United States has never had an official national language, though there have been calls to designate one through legislation or a constitutional amendment going back to the eighteenth century. The real events underlying the German-but-by-a-single-vote story date to 1794. In that year the U. S. House of Representatives received a petition from a group of German-speakers in Virginia requesting that federal laws be published in German as well as English. Although a House committee endorsed this petition, when it came to a discussion on the floor of the House in early 1795, support was apparently weak. On January 13 of that year, after some debate, a vote was called to adjourn and defer further consideration of the committee’s recommendation. That vote was forty-two to forty-one against adjournment. Although the vote was not on the merits of the question itself, it apparently reflected only tepid support for translating the laws into German. Some time later, the petition was formally rejected, though exactly what the final tally was is not known.
     
  40. LoVe 2 TcH

    LoVe 2 TcH Companion

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    I am fluent in Romanian. Not a very useful language in the US, but it does help, (a bit) with translating from Spanish!
     

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