Class Size

Discussion in 'Elementary Education' started by Bumble, Jan 18, 2009.

  1. Bumble

    Bumble Groupie

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    I was grading papers and realized that I have a 4th grade class of 31 students. Is this legal? I looked online and could only find the legal class size for grades k-3, which is 1 teacher for 17 students and 2 teachers for 35 students. This class I cannot get much done. Controlling 31 behaviors for 45 minutes is tough. Is there anything that I really can do? How big are your classes?

    Thanks!
     
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  3. chicagoturtle

    chicagoturtle Fanatic

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    I think it depends on your union/district. Here are kindergartens can often be up to 32 without an aide. I think our K teachers would love to have 17 kids in their classes! Class sizes aren't really grievable here anyway. The most you get is an extra prep period or no morning duty. Good luck with finding your answer.
     
  4. Bumble

    Bumble Groupie

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    Thanks. The only classes that are below 17 are the special ed classes. I wish I could have 17 or less in each class.
     
  5. Beezus

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    It depends on your district. I have 29 2nd graders....yikes!
     
  6. old-new teacher

    old-new teacher Comrade

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    I did my student teaching in a classroom with 31 fifth graders. It was very tough! I don't thin their are "laws" limited class size, but I'm sure districts set policy on it. The class I student taught in was an anomoly...our district tries to limit class size to a 20:1 ratio in the elementary grades, but our community was in desperate need of a new grade school that year. We are still growing and currently have 3 new elementary schools being built right now.
     
  7. Bumble

    Bumble Groupie

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    hmmm....I have a special ed degree. I NEED to find a special ed position for the fall, which shouldn't be hard. I couldn't find anything midyear. Special ed classes are small. I think I can only handle small classes.

    I guess I was living in a fairytale where there is a limit on class size...
     
  8. RainStorm

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    Our special ed teachers don't have separate classes, so they are co-teaching in inclusion classes. They are generally split among 4 different classes, and since the class has an "extra" teacher, the inclusion class is always the one they overload!!! So I wouldn't necessarily count on having a small class.

    Now our severe and profound students, they have small group sizes -- sometimes one-on-one, but never more than one-to-three. But even those students spend at least part of the day mainstreamed into general education classes.
     
  9. DOBY

    DOBY Rookie

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    california have a 20 to 1 class size for k-3rd. with the budget bad, i think they would have larger numbers than that now. Bumble, i feel for you. i know 31 is a large number especially with behavior problems but, teachers here are losing their jobs and some would not mind any number as long as they have a job. so cheer up lol. :cool:
     
  10. luckyal29

    luckyal29 Companion

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    as stated before in CA it's 20-1 for k-3rd. 4-5 is 32.

    And when I was teaching in China, my 2nd grade class had 50 students. My 6th grade was 64. Now that was tough classroom management.
     
  11. Bumble

    Bumble Groupie

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    I could not imagine 64 6th graders! wow!
     
  12. DOBY

    DOBY Rookie

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    You need to let the students know who the boss is. You have to be firm. I start out the school year as a mean teacher or so they students feel initially and when I have laid a fundation of my expectation, then i begin to ease off a little yet consistent with the rules. My kids come to love my class, they know I discipline and love at the same time. I think you have to find behavior management that will work for you and your students. Good luck.
     
  13. Samothrace

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    I teach 33 classes a week K-6. My class sizes range anywhere from 16-31-32. For whatever reason our 3rd grade classes just become huge! Last year I had 33 and 34, this year I think they might be down to 29 or so. But I don't classify them as 30 typical third graders. Teaching inner city is a whole other world.

    It amazes me how the states can let the variation from district to district be so drastic!
     
  14. RainStorm

    RainStorm Phenom

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    The other thing to remember as far as classsize goes -- in many states (such as Virginia) the sizes are based on the number of students on a grade level divided by the number of teachers (total, not just classroom teachers). So in our school, the reading specialist, the gifted resource teacher, the special ed teacher, all get factored in! One year I had 29 in my class, but we met the "optional" size limit of 22 students per class.
     
  15. MsMar

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    Philadelphia class size limit is 33 for 4th grade and up, so your 31 is allowed. Not fun though, that's for sure!
     
  16. SpecSub

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    Our school doesn't pull out at all. We plug in and work with sped kids in general ed rooms. A LOT of work there, because we're expected to assume responsibility for at-risk and even ESOL kids. At least in our school. We also have to plan with the general ed teachers so co-teaching can occur.
     
  17. JaimeMarie

    JaimeMarie Moderator

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    I just tried to look up PA class size restrictions. It looks like that PA doesn't have restrictions on regular ed class sizes. So it left up to the district to decide how many students are allowed in a classroom.
     
  18. Go 4th

    Go 4th Habitué

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    In Ga, the class size for 4th is 28. However, this year, with the budget issues, the governor approved an additional 2 students per class per grade. Supposedly it is for this year only. So next year, we can have 30 students. Next years numbers are--K-20, 1st and 2nd--22, 3rd 24, 4th 30, and 5th 32.
    Ridiculous.
     
  19. goopp

    goopp Devotee

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    But how many do you actually have? Although I can have 28 in my 4th grade class, we have 6 classes with 20 or 21 in each. It all depends on how good your principal is at working the numbers. (We have 2 inclusion classes which are reduced class size, and one EIP class, which also is a reduced class size model. That means the rest of us get smaller classes, too.)
     
  20. Arky

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    We have a limit of 20-1 for K, 25-1 for 1-3, and 28-1 for 4-6. This is controlled by our state. You will need to check yours to see if you have limits.
     
  21. jw13

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    Many states and districts have "suggested class limits". At my last district, they had it in the contract language..."no more than 26 students per classroom, when possible". There also wasn't any language to accomodate if student/teacher ratio went above that. My current district states no more than 31 students per classroom when possible. If ALL class at a grade level exceed that, then it is stated that an aide will be hired for all teachers to share...although that hasn't been put to the test yet.
     
  22. cheeryteacher

    cheeryteacher Enthusiast

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    In one class I have 34 w/special ed. They are a bit more talkative than smaller classes, but overall I don't mind.
     
  23. Go 4th

    Go 4th Habitué

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    Right now I have 23. I've varied between 24 and 20 this year. I'm in a trailer so my numbers are kept low. All the other teachers are at max.
     
  24. EMonkey

    EMonkey Connoisseur

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    In California maximum number of students is set by each district and the local union. Each district can use the class reduction money and have 20 children from k-3. The district probably also has a maximum in case of a overcrowded classroom. In the district I work in it is 27 for k, 30 for 1-3, 32 for 4 and 5. That only happens if the school goes over twenty for the lower classes.
     
  25. trayums

    trayums Enthusiast

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    Oh my goodness! That's a lot of kids.
     
  26. TiffanyL

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    I work for a CA district that did away with class size reduction a few years ago. I teach 3rd grade and have 32 students as do the other teachers.
     
  27. Hoot Owl

    Hoot Owl Aficionado

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    I only have 17 this year, most teachers in my hall do too.

    Ten years ago I had 27 5th graders and it was just awful. Some of those kids were bigger than I was.

    In our district they have max sizes of 22 for second grade, per instructional personal. When they count heads and divide, they include the librarian, counselor, and extra support personal which ups the ante to 27 in a class. We're just really fortunate to have just 17.
     
  28. Hoot Owl

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    Bumble, keep those kids busily engaged in work. As soon as they walk in the door have something for them to get started on before they begin socializing, let them know what they're doing is extremely important to the foundation of their education. Be firm, loving, and consistent.
     
  29. snickydog

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    I wish I had fewer students! I have 29 first graders, with no aide. And that's down from 30 after one moved!!!
     
  30. 4alicat

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    Our class sizes are set in our contract. K-3 can have up to 20 kids. 4th & 5th grade can go up to 36!!
     

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