All behaviors and SpEd in one class

Discussion in 'Elementary Education' started by RubberRoad, Sep 21, 2016.

  1. RubberRoad

    RubberRoad Rookie

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2016
    Messages:
    14
    Likes Received:
    12

    Sep 21, 2016

    Hi all! I'm new here. I've been a teacher for 12 years and am starting at a new school district this year in a failing urban school. I had always considered myself impeccable in classroom management but I'm really struggling this year.

    After talking to staff about it, it turns out they deliberately placed ALL behavior students and Special Ed kids in my class and gave the other third grade teacher 10 high achieving second graders and 14 high achieving/well behaved third graders instead. The idea was that if she has s combo I should have all the behavior/sped :(

    I have four sped kids (who are all also behavior problems) and an additional five "high flyers." So in total I have 9 extremely difficult students to manage. No aids. Minimal parent support. My class is.so.insanely.crazy!!!

    I've never heard of this strategy for classroom placement before. What do you all think? Is it fair? Is it legal? Common?

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2.  
  3. bella84

    bella84 Aficionado

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2012
    Messages:
    3,935
    Likes Received:
    1,922

    Sep 21, 2016


    Fair? No. Legal? Probably. Common? Depends which schools you are comparing it to.

    I can relate to the classroom mgmt struggles. I've always considered that a given strength for me. But I just started at a new school this year. It's a great school, but so many things are different from where I've been before. I'm so overwhelmed, and I feel like I'm struggling to get my mgmt back to where I'm used to it being.

    I think the situation is not ethical at all, and I think it's really unfair to those students who are in your class. I feel bad for you and very sorry for them.
     
    RubberRoad likes this.
  4. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,252
    Likes Received:
    1,822

    Sep 21, 2016

    Ethical? No. It shouldn't happen. But it does, more often than it should I'm sure.

    I know this is not what you want to hear at all, but since you're stuck in this situation, maybe try seeing it as a opportunity to further strengthen your classroom management skills. If you can get that class to function normally, then you know you can take on anything.

    One of my classes is similar to yours - at least three are already diagnosed with ADD and probably another three should be. It is a tough crowd. Making it worse is that, in that mix of difficult kids, I also have some incredibly bright kids who are getting the raw end of a deal since I'm trying so hard to keep the others on task. I'm trying to flip that - acknowledge the good kids more and expend less energy on the ones who are disruptive. One thing I'm using more as the year progresses is positive notes home. Sending home positive messages with the kids who are doing what they should be keeps them feeling positive about school and being in the classroom.
     
    RubberRoad likes this.
  5. waterfall

    waterfall Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Messages:
    6,129
    Likes Received:
    981

    Sep 21, 2016

    This has happened in my school this year because the district is making us "cluster" kids in preparation for moving towards full inclusion (ELL, title, sped, etc. services happening inside the gen ed room). Since we no longer have actual gifted teachers, they decided to cluster those kids into one class per grade level and supposedly give that teacher extra training. They said no "red" kids could be in that cluster, so basically the gifted cluster teachers are getting the easiest classes. I teach in a very low SES area, so by saying that one of the three classes per grade level can't have any "reds," you're pretty much guaranteeing that the other two classes are almost all low kids. The ELL students are also clustered this year because ELL is already starting push-in only. At least they tend to be fairly well behaved. We got out of clustering sped this year, but I imagine we'll be doing that next year. At some grade levels that could mean 11-13 students with IEPs in one class, and those kids also tend to be the most significant behavior problems. Our most significant behavior kids often end up getting misidentified as learning disabled because they miss so much instruction over the years (either by being out of the classroom in the office or just doing/accessing absolutely nothing when they are in the classroom)
     
    RubberRoad and Backroads like this.
  6. MrsC

    MrsC Multitudinous

    Joined:
    Aug 8, 2005
    Messages:
    14,070
    Likes Received:
    1,886

    Sep 22, 2016

    This often happens in schools I've worked in. They organize classes this way to maximize the in-class support for the students. This year, I have "that class". 32 grade 7s--13 with IEPs. Thankfully, I don't have any behaviour issues, although those students don't tend to be clustered. I was a Special Ed teacher for many years, so, I understand why it makes sense to put many of the kids who don't need to be withdrawn with me. Planning is a challenge as I'm getting to know them and as we are just beginning to write their IEPs for the year, but I'll get there.
     
    RubberRoad likes this.
  7. TeacherNY

    TeacherNY Maven

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,263
    Likes Received:
    1,610

    Sep 22, 2016

    I don't know where you are but around here if the class has ANY special ed kids they have at least 1 aide. How do they expect you to work on IEPs when there's nobody to assist you?
     
    MLB711, otterpop and RubberRoad like this.
  8. Newkindermom

    Newkindermom Rookie

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2015
    Messages:
    88
    Likes Received:
    12

    Sep 22, 2016

    I have seen this happen in the district I used to work in and had it happen to me. It's not fair to the teacher or students. I would not complain but mention a class with sped and behavior students needs to have MORE role model students.. That's the whole point of inclusion. So students with special needs can benefit from good role models and be a part of a classroom community.. NOT so service providers will have an easier time getting to their kids. I used to be so pro inclusion.. But after seeing this happen and seeing how most inclusion is not being done the right way I am really not always for it. In fact, when I taught sped my students learned so much more with pull out with me in a small, quiet classroom for 30 minutes than they did all day in "inclusion."
     
    RubberRoad likes this.
  9. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    6,334
    Likes Received:
    2,221

    Sep 22, 2016

    It's all about the schedule rather than the kids. I've seen kids placed in inappropriate placements (low class for their area of strength) just to allow the schedule to work out better. All other kids with the label were placed in the same class if not in pull-out for that subject. So, the family had a choice to keep their kid in a class that the child did not belong or forgo services in a class where the child needed support. That is completely illegal and only came up with the teacher of the class where the child didn't belong had the strength to let the family know what was going on.
     
    RubberRoad likes this.
  10. teacherintexas

    teacherintexas Maven

    Joined:
    Jul 7, 2005
    Messages:
    5,285
    Likes Received:
    754

    Sep 22, 2016

    Wow! That would be nice. I had seven sped kids in one class last year and no help.
     
  11. TeacherNY

    TeacherNY Maven

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,263
    Likes Received:
    1,610

    Sep 23, 2016

    Yes, even in my friend's son's class. He has Asperger's and has a lot of behavior problems (although academically 3 years ahead of his classmates) and they put an AIDE in the classroom as soon as he got his IEP written. The class ran much smoother since the aide took a few kids aside at various times a day so the teacher could work more closely with those with IEPs.
    Also, a co-worker was repeatedly called about her son's behavior in class. My co-worker didn't want to rush to get him labeled but thinks he might have some issues so she talked with the school and they got him a 1:1 aide. Now, the other kids can actually learn! Wow, what a concept. Now, I can't imagine having several of those types of kids with no assistants whatsoever. That's just a recipe for disaster. Maybe the parents need to speak up about it?
     
    Backroads and otterpop like this.
  12. otterpop

    otterpop Phenom

    Joined:
    Jun 14, 2013
    Messages:
    4,252
    Likes Received:
    1,822

    Sep 23, 2016

    Your state is definitely an exception when compared with states in the Western US. In the multiple states I've been in, aides are almost never provided for an IEP, unless it's a very serious situation (like ED). Even then, though, the student is more likely to be put in a self contained classroom.
     
  13. a2z

    a2z Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Sep 16, 2010
    Messages:
    6,334
    Likes Received:
    2,221

    Sep 23, 2016

    Aides are rare here also except for overloaded pull-out classes in elementary school (think special education classes with 18+ kids in them), but they tend to shove all kids, regardless of how far behind, into general education classes with a special education teacher if they are not developmentally delayed. These classes tend to have the maximum number of kids allowed by the state. Pull out after elementary is almost unheard of in a lot of districts.

    So, while it may sound great that there is an aide (or even a special education teacher in the class) most times the kids don't get what they need. It is all window dressing because what needs to be done for the varying students just can't be done in the setting they are in and the high number of students.
     
  14. Backroads

    Backroads Aficionado

    Joined:
    Apr 23, 2010
    Messages:
    3,671
    Likes Received:
    1,965

    Sep 23, 2016

    In Utah/Idaho, I've seen it depend entirely on the school/district. At my charter school, 1:1 aides for full or part time are not uncommon on IEPs for severe behaviors. I recall it being handled similarly at my last district and in Idaho.

    But a friend teaches in Colorado and says it near impossible to get anything similar there.
     
  15. waterfall

    waterfall Virtuoso

    Joined:
    Feb 5, 2011
    Messages:
    6,129
    Likes Received:
    981

    Sep 23, 2016

    I teach in Colorado. 1:1 aides are unheard of. This is my 7th year; I've taught in 3 districts and have never seen one. We have at least one kid per grade level that is violent, destroys property, runs around/runs away and screams for much of the day. I had a kinder student one year in diapers and functioning at a 1 year old level. They wouldn't put him on self contained right away and they wouldn't hire an aide. I and the rest of my sped team had to rotate through babysitting him all day, meaning none of our other kids got their hours met. He was finally moved right before Thanksgiving that year. It's not always admins fault; school funding is absolutely abysmal here. We are already one of the lowest in per pupil funding and the state doesn't even give us what they say they will. Each year they say sorry, we just don't have the money. They call what they don't pay "the negative factor." I have no idea how this is even legal. And no, we're not getting pot money. That's a tiny amount that can only be used for infrastructure needs in rural schools; I'm in a metro area.
     
  16. TeachCafe

    TeachCafe Comrade

    Joined:
    Feb 12, 2015
    Messages:
    261
    Likes Received:
    30

    Sep 28, 2016

    I had that class earlier this year. Behavior central and 4 sped. Of those four only two work my nerves.The non-sped are worse though because I have medication central in my homeroom. ADHD/ADD off the wall. I get one of the sped teachers and 2 TAs at different times so on a day, 3 people are coming in and out of my room. I'm use to it from sped with OT, PT, SLP, etc coming in and out so that's nothing.

    As a former sped teacher, the in class support is for the birds IMO. I do not see students really receiving the services they need but whatever. The whole "they need to be included" yes I get that and yes they do but good grief, pull them out for 30 minutes and give them that small group. The push in model with the sped teacher working with all students as a co-teacher and not just pulling the sped students to the side IMO isn't doing sped students any favors.

    A 30 minute pullout isn't that serious.

    I really like the push in sped teacher that comes in my room but I just don't see the push in model benefiting my students.
     
  17. TeacherNY

    TeacherNY Maven

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2008
    Messages:
    5,263
    Likes Received:
    1,610

    Sep 29, 2016

    Well, some of those conditions mentioned sound deplorable. I know a lot of people talk badly about teaching in NY state where I work but seriously, I've never EVER had to teach any special education students in a room alone. Even when subbing. I applaud any of you who are able to actually teach in your current situations.
     

Share This Page

Members Online Now

  1. stargirl
Total: 216 (members: 6, guests: 177, robots: 33)
test