Accused of assault

Discussion in 'Secondary Education' started by newbie12, Jun 1, 2017.

  1. DAH

    DAH Companion

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    [QUOTE="AlwaysAttend,... It's just part of societal progress. [/QUOTE]


    I would rather call it, "societal DECLINE."
     
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  2. DAH

    DAH Companion

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    Caesar, if nothing more, it serves as a PROTECTION for the victim, a DEFENSE for the accused, PROOF for the prosecutor, and a DETERRENT for the offender...I think it's worth it.
     
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  3. Caesar753

    Caesar753 Multitudinous

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    What I'm suggesting is that the idea of cameras serving as "protection" is where this falls short. Cameras won't stop anything from happening unless you have the resources and personnel to immediately respond to every suspicious event. That's not feasible.
     
  4. a2z

    a2z Maven

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    I think it depends on what the protection is. This started by the issue being falsely accused of something. In that case, it does not stop someone from falsely accusing you (it may deter so in a way it may protect), but it certainly does protect you from the potential ramifications of the accusations in a he said/she said circumstance.

    Will it stop every instance of crime? Well no. Cameras don't do that anywhere. However, it does deter some which is a form of protection from someone who would otherwise commit the offense if they knew they were not being recorded.
     
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  5. DAH

    DAH Companion

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    [QUOTE="a2z, This However, it does deter some which is a form of protection from someone who would otherwise commit the offense if they knew they were not being recorded.[/QUOTE]


    Amen.
     
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  6. Linguist92021

    Linguist92021 Phenom

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    Yes, of course if I inappropriate touch a kid, or threw something at them, then yes, they would be used. What the teacher telling me was talking about were things like I can't get in trouble because they saw that during the whole class I was sitting behind my desk, doing things on the computer and not walking around, etc.
     
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  7. MathGuy82

    MathGuy82 Companion

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    The problem is, is when incompetent administrators believe children/teenagers and take their words as a real truth without any factual evidence. Yes, some events are true and there are some bad apples out there, but I am sick and tired of hearing stories where someone can call a tip line anonymously and the teacher is under investigation with leave. I've never had this happen to me or anyone in my school. However, let's make sure it never happens to anyone. I've seen stories on the news since I was a kid on how certain teachers were falsely accused. Of course, they have to go on leave in the process, it's more like proven guilty until innocent. Bring on the cameras. If we don't have anything to hide, why not have them? Why are there cameras and recordings nearly everywhere you shop?? Should we not choose to shop at a place that has cameras because we aren't trusted? Should we decide not to go to restaurant/bar on the boulevard because there are cameras in there? No, it because of the few bad apples that take profit/commit crime acts from the business and so now everyone has to be watched. Nearly every department store/government office today has cameras unless it's the bathroom or a changing/try on clothes area. Police stations, drivers license offices, and banks are all have recordings in the main areas. Not the best of circumstances, but at least there is proof. Since I worked at a grocery store in my teens and early 20's, I saw lots of theft. Several shoppers would try to walk out with beer and other items without paying, as well as a few employees I worked with. Guess what, they replayed the cameras to each person caught and there was PROOF. No one was sitting there watching every move, but there was always a record. There was no guessing, or no word against another or who could lie the best, there was proof by recording.
     
    Last edited: Aug 5, 2017
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  8. a2z

    a2z Maven

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    While I'm all for the concept of innocent until proven guilty for all, I can say that I am not for allowing teachers to remain in the classroom based on certain accusations. Maybe it is because there were predators in a few of our local schools over the last decade.

    I also think kids should be innocent until proven guilty also. That is the standard of our country even though none of it really works that way. Way too many kids were punished in the past for things that were not their fault or had extenuating circumstances that could not be controlled.

    Teachers just don't like being in the same position that students have been in for a hundred years.
     
    Last edited: Aug 7, 2017
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  9. TeacherNY

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    Yeah, because the administrators are scared of parents complaining and they don't want to have to deal with them. Of course the parents are going to believe the student, therefore if the administrator is a wimp, he/she has to go along with it to keep the whining parent quiet. I'm sure this isn't the case ALL the time but it's obvious that it does happen.
     
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  10. AlwaysAttend

    AlwaysAttend Fanatic

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    Agreed. I'm sorry, but I think most agree that children are to be treated with the utmost caution. That's why there is paid leave in most cases. Teachers do have a recourse with unfounded allegations (even if it's not a good one), a lawsuit. Financially holding the family and school district accountable for frivolous claims is available as a recourse, even if it cannot restore your reputation. There are enough bad apples that this even has to be a discussion.
     
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  11. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Several posts have been moderated: one post that went off topic and two posts that quoted it.

    Members are reminded that the proper way to flag a post is to use the "Report" link at the bottom of the offending post. Reporting brings the post to the moderators' attention faster; replying, and quoting in reply, just fans flames and makes more work for the moderators.
     
  12. a2z

    a2z Maven

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    TeacherGroupie,
    What is your suggestion when people are saying multiple things if not to quote the one you are discussing. Without quoting, I can't see discussions working well at all. I do understand that when something becomes reportable it is extra work for moderators to clean up, but how can people have a discussion that makes sense without either addressing the person they are responding to or quoting the part of a post they are discussing?
     
  13. catnfiddle

    catnfiddle Moderator

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    The problem is that the original reported post was quoted by two other forum members, mostly in complaint. TG had to moderate all three instead of just one.
     
  14. AlwaysAttend

    AlwaysAttend Fanatic

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    AllI know is I wrote a very nuanced reply that will never be seen haha.
     
  15. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    Here's what I mean:

    1. Sometimes a member's post is in and of itself not problematic, but in the absence of the problematic post that triggered it, it no longer makes sense. In that case, moderators will unapprove or delete the post.

    2. When a post is problematic enough to be unapproved or deleted, a member's subsequent post that quotes it is also unapproved or deleted; this is longstanding A to Z practice, in the interest of ensuring that the problematic content is no longer visible even in quotation.

    3. The person whose post is moderated is welcome to repost with modification: a problematic quote can be excised or paraphrased, or one's own paragraph that got the fireworks going can be made less incendiary or eliminated and the rest reposted. (That would have been a fine solution at least once in this case.)

    4. Replying to a problematic post simply to point out that It Oughta Be Moderated is not useful. Again, that's what the "Report" link is for. See also http://forums.atozteacherstuff.com/index.php?threads/inappropriate-post-report-dont-respond.198718/.

    5. Let me emphasize that the member whose post is deleted or unapproved under points 1 and 2 is generally not in trouble with the moderators: we're simply doing the housekeeping, as we do when we delete duplicate posts on request. The member whose post is deleted or unapproved under point 4, however, is skating on thin ice, and the ice gets thinner with repetition.
     
    Last edited: Aug 8, 2017
  16. TeacherGroupie

    TeacherGroupie Moderator

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    You're more than welcome, anon55.
     
  17. Linguist92021

    Linguist92021 Phenom

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    Aug 12, 2017

    In our back to school packets we also got a form that describes what cameras do and dont' do. It spells out that cameras cannot be used for teacher evaluation or for discipline regarding teaching or classroom management.
    Definitely a good way to use it.
    Of course I'll be signing again this year opting for the cameras in my classroom.
     
  18. DAH

    DAH Companion

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    [QUOTE="Linguist92021, I'll be signing again this year opting for the cameras in my classroom.[/QUOTE]

    Good luck, Linguist.
    I don't know why administration would fight against progress. Sooner or later, cams WILL BE in every classroom and church, just as they are in every bank and grocery store. They may as well get a head start; parents ought to INSIST upon it.
     
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  19. MathGuy82

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    I think though, that principals should say when they are evaluating if they are using the camera. I don't think anyone should be hired to just "watch" all the time unless it's a really tough school. Unless the contract says for students and teachers, "area under camera's". Then, principals could give feedback when needed. The point is, is that we shouldn't have to have cameras. However, the way things are now days, and with cameras pretty much everywhere you walk in, it's necessary and it gives us a sense of security and justice. I know that these types of students are very rare that may try to falsely accuse a teacher, but at least we have PROOF.
     
    Last edited: Aug 13, 2017
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